Luminescent Ink On Circus Wagon Coil Stamp

I have a question concerning a Coil Transportation Stamp. One version of the Scotts # 2452Bf 05 cent Circus Wagon is suppose to contain luminescent ink and be untagged.

"untagged gravure Andreotti press
printed with luminescent ink; Pl# A3"

I used the UV light to see the tag on some of these stamps but I do not see the luminescent ink.

Can anyone help me on how to determine if the Ink is Luminescent?

Any help would be appreciated, thank you in advance.

The luminescent ink will glow a bright fluorescent orange under short wave UV light. Under long wave UV the ink glows slightly.

Robert

The problem I am having if I understand it correctly is on the site www.1847usa.com it says the coil number A3 should have Luminescent ink but when I put short wave UV light on my strip that is marked with A3 it does not show anything that I can see.

This is the discription from 1847USA site:

"untagged gravure Andreotti press
printed with luminescent ink; Pl# A3"

Do I have an oddity or am I just not seeing it right? :)

I checked the 2012 Durland catalog and it states A3 was printed with luminescent ink on the Andreotti press. There is no mention of A3 being printed without luminescent ink, so I don't know what the problem could be. Sorry.

Robert

I'm at work right now but when I get home I will try again with a dark dark room and see if I can see any glow at all.
Thanks for the help Robert!

PK stamper, I just tried my strips of 2452. I took a strip with plate number A2 and one with A3 and placed them side by side.
Illuminating them with a short wave UV light did do barely anything, but with a long wave light the ink really lights up!
On the picture you show in the opening thread I do not see a platenumber. That stamp may not be a plate A3 example?

Peter

Peter,
Thanks for the heads up. I put a stock photo up for an example. The one I have I have not scanned yet. I have not tried long wave I will have to get a long wave uv light. Would a standard black light work for that, do you think?

I am not sure, although I think it could. Short wave is the dangerous one, but it is the light used to detect tagging here in the US. Black lights are used in disco's and places like that and luminescent T-shirts will glow. Try it, it is cheaper. And let us know what you come up with! By the way, long wave UV is used here in the US to detect "Hibrite" papers, among other uses.

Peter

I attached a copy of the stamps so you could see them. Not the best scan still learning this.

I got the black light and it works but what is funny is that the 6 stamp set shows a really bright glow. The 4 stamp set with the 3A plate number bearly glows just like the 5 stamp set. I think it has something to do with the paper too the one that glows the best the paper almost looks dark while the others are kind of bright.

But it appears that the black light works for luminescing the ink.

Now if I can only tell the difference in the engraved vs. the photogravure I will be set to sort these stamps.

Thanks again Peter for your help.

And I hope this helps the other trying to determine Luminescent Inks.

PK stamper, the bottom row with the bright luminescence is probably the BEP version of this stamp! I don't think the blacklite is working very well, you will need a real long wave UV light to see the luminescence. On the A3 stamps the red really jumps out if you have the correct light!

Peter

Peter,
What do you mean by BEP version?

Also I will look for a better long wave UV light, to see if I can see this better. Thanks for the guidance.

PK stamper, this particular stamp has been printed by three different printers. The first batch was done by the Bureau of Engraving and Printing. There were three different plates used, plate 1 was tagged, plate 2 & 3 were untagged. The second, similar printing was by Guilford Gravure by the American Bank Note Company. Three different plates were used also, plate A1, A2 & A3. Plate A3 was the one you are interested about, it was the one printed with the special ink.
The third printer was Stamp Venturers, again three different plates used, this time plates S1, S2 & S3. These stamps are easily recognized, the denomination is printed as "5", rather then "05".
If you like, go to www.PNC3.org, all info on these stamps is to be found there!

Peter

Peter
I see what you were talking about with the BEP. I have been using www.1847USA.com site but www.PNC3.org has great information too. I do not think I have any BEP stamps though because they do not look like they are Engraved but look to be more Photoengraved. If I understand this correctly I should be able to see the effect by how the Ink is raised in the Engraved stamp vs. the photoengraved. Is this correct?
As for the Luminescent Ink, by using the short UV and the Long UV I think I have seperated the stamps. Using the black light I was able to see the luminescent Ink but some pop better than others it maybe because they are used stamps and have been affected by the elements. The short UV helped though, because what I see using the short wave is the Non-Luminescent gives a dark blood red almost brown look to the ink while the Luminescent Ink kind of stays the same looking. Then under the black light I see a bright to a faint glow on the luminescent Ink.
I think you are correct that a better UV would make them pop brighter it may be due to the strength of the UV bulb too. I will see if someone in my stamp group has a proper light that I can view them under to comfirm this, or purchase one which is probably what I should do.

Again thank you so very much for your help.

Perry

It is harder to examine stamps under long wave UV when the stamps are still on paper because many papers give off such a bright reaction that they can overwhelm things.