Stamp Community Family of Web Sites
Thousands of stamps, consistently graded, competitively priced and hundreds of in-depth blog posts to read
Stamp Community Forum
 
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

Welcome Guest! Need help? Got a question? Inherit some stamps?
Our stamp forum is completely free! Register Now!

US Scotts 312 - Offered On Ebay - Not

Previous Page | Next Page    
 
To participate in the forum you must log in or register.
Author Previous TopicReplies: 31 / Views: 3,658Next Topic
Page: of 3
Pillar Of The Community
United States
936 Posts
Posted 01/24/2017   2:18 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rgstamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I don't bid/buy from apfelbaum... wasn't this outfit involved in big scam years ago? I think they were prosecuted and lost. They do not have good reputation, Other sites have recommended keeping distance from them.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United States
936 Posts
Posted 01/24/2017   2:24 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rgstamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United States
2478 Posts
Posted 01/24/2017   3:26 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add chasa to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
rlsny: There is a short list of most-nasty US misidentifications. IMHO at the top are Scotts 315 5-cent 1902 imperforates made with scissors, Scotts 479/480 2 and 5 dollar perf-10 offered as 312/313, both of Bill's mentioned here], and almost all US coils Scott 348-447.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United States
2473 Posts
Posted 01/24/2017   4:35 pm  Show Profile Check sinclair2010's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add sinclair2010 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
So much in this thread to respond to...

The seller of the 479's, for good reason, doesn't enjoy glowing endorsements from everybody.

Making buying decisions guided by blind faith in any dealer, auction house, venue, or institution rather than intelligence is a sure way to get burned eventually. eBay is a wonderful place to buy stamps. Some of the best, most honest philatelists sell almost exclusively there.

If I had my choice between buying the same stamp on eBay or SAN, I would choose eBay every single time. Easier returns. I have had to return stamps bought via SAN from big auction houses and probably should have returned some others.

Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United States
936 Posts
Posted 01/24/2017   4:49 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rgstamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I'm a one and done guy. I get burned once or notice one inaccurate listing that I feel is purposeful, I'll never go back . So far I haven't been burned (that I can tell) buying from major houses ... however I feel like I pay a premium for this service. I see a lot more (I stress "a lot") inaccurate listings/forgeries/fakes on eBay than at major auction houses, but perhaps that is because of the sheer volume of listings on eBay! I just think stamp dealers are in downward spiral. Hard to keep positive cash flow in an environment where prices are very soft. I think there are experts on this board with so much experience they will never get burned on eBay. I don't trust my stamp expertise yet, especially buying more valuable stuff.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United States
663 Posts
Posted 01/24/2017   6:00 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add alub to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
After I saw this initial thread, I sent William Lang a polite note pointing out the error. He quickly corrected the post.

We all make mistakes, and I appreciate it when people correct them.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United States
650 Posts
Posted 01/24/2017   6:36 pm  Show Profile Check kcaramat's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add kcaramat to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
There is a solution... we need someone willing to take on an eBay, get large enough, and offer buyer protection. Money back guarantee if bought through the site. In order to put your stamps on site, you have to offer 90 day money back guarantee or whatever buyer protection deemed policy by the site.


I have heard that the APS has allocated $50,000 to investigate creating an auction site to be part of their website.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Moderator
Learn More...
United States
10439 Posts
Posted 01/24/2017   7:53 pm  Show Profile Check 51studebaker's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add 51studebaker to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
APS has one thing going for over eBay; it allows buyers to have a much greater level of confidence when buying.

So rather than trying to compete with them why not consider packaging this into an enhanced 'seller certification' program. They could certify a seller, in other words guarantee the sale, no matter which online venue would be used. Buyers could verify the seller by a special 'APS seller' icon and an online database on the APS site which contains a list of all approved sellers. Basically an expansion of the APS member number which includes additional APS support for buyers.

APS would then be required to resolve disputes. While additional overhead, this would be required no matter what approach they do if they want to expend their online store. Plus, it offers a nice tie in with their existing APEX services.

How it might work…
Jane, an APS member and hobbyist, joins the APS seller certification program. She reads the terms and conditions and pays the additional fees. This gives her access to the APS seller icon for her listings and adds her to the APS approved seller database. She feels good that the icon will attract more buyer confidence and knows that if a problem arises that APS will mediate the dispute fairly.

Joe, not an APS member, sees an online listing (any venue) from Jane. Joe clicks on the icon and is taken to the APS which describes the additional protection the program gives him. He makes the purchase and the stamp arrives a few days later. Upon closer examination, he feels the stamp was not as described. He contacts Jane but they cannot resolve the issue. A dispute form on the APS site is completed and this starts the resolution process.

Some disputes may be resolved without a lot of additional work while others might require the stamp to be submitted for their opinion. The APS decisions would be final.

Much like any other type insurance, the numbers would have to be crunched to see if this would be viable. From a NRE (Non-recurring engineering) cost standpoint, this type of program is much more feasible development and implementation for APS to attain than trying to build a world class online store.

If they want to push forward with greatly improving their online store than they need to spend money on in-house resources. Outsourcing the development, implementation, and support of a substantial online store would never make financial sense. At a minimum they will need some in-house maintenance expertise.

Seems to me that APS would be far better packaging a type of 'seller program' then trying to compete with the existing online selling venues.
Don
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United States
936 Posts
Posted 01/24/2017   8:24 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rgstamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Don,

I like your idea very much. I am not an APS member. It has been on my list of things to do (join) but not a priority. I guess I haven't joined yet because the I haven't noticed any service they would offer that I need. Joining for me is more for the satisfaction of making a philanthropic donation to an organization that helps keep the hobby moving in the right direction. If APS could offer buyer protection that would be a big plus. In the past it seemed APS also served to "banish" or suspend the bad apple dealer (such as Apelbaum as example). But as posted recently, this service to the stamp community has also essentially gone away. There are a few sites that still give advice on which dealers to stay away from and which have good reputation (Swedish tiger comes to mind). If APS offers me buyer protection from APS member dealers or even better APS sanctioned auction sites, well that would be something worth paying a membership for
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United States
2478 Posts
Posted 01/24/2017   10:10 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add chasa to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
alub: this one needs to be changed also: http://www.ebay.com/itm/300-312-SHO...AOSwXeJXfxYF notice a trend?
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
Learn More...
United States
1307 Posts
Posted 01/24/2017   10:46 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add JLLebbert to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Don ... My initial reaction to your "APS Seller Certification" plan was positive. But after mulling it over a bit, I simply can't see the APS tackling this. It's one thing to certify a stamp ... it's an entirely different thing to certify a seller who vends his/her wares on some on-line venue over which the APS has no control. I could see some sellers trying to game the system (much as has been done on eBay in the past), obtaining a certification then, at some future point, abusing that certificate. The question then would be "Who is liable for damages suffered by the buyer?" Nor can I see the APS acting as "sherrif", watching over certified sellers to ensure that they adhere to the certification guidelines.
But, while I don't think your plan as suggested is workable, it does seem to be a step ... no, make that an idea ... that moves us in the right direction. Perhaps one possible fix would be for "certified sellers" to guarantee that their buyers have the right to send any purchase to the APS for authentication (at the buyer's expense unless the item is not deemed genuine). One problem with this, of course, is the length of time that APEX seems to need to expertize an item. Also, how does the APS, as a third party, enforce whatever rules govern the program? Why would eBay even entertain such a program?
Still, I do find your idea intriguing.
John
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
Learn More...
United States
1116 Posts
Posted 01/24/2017   11:17 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Al E. Gator to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Don, I'm kinda with John on this one. The idea is good, but I don't see the APS doing it. I was involved in a fairly lengthy thread on another site about 3 years ago regarding APS circuits. It involved my concern for the amount of fake Washington/Franklin coil stamps showing up in circuit books. There were a couple of folks who expertize for the APS and a couple of folks from the APS including the person responsible for the circuits involved it that thread. At the end of the conversation, the basic position of the APS was that they do a quick visual check and do try to catch some of the most obvious errors, but they just do not have the manpower nor the time to insure all stamps in circuits are what they are said to be. There are still fake coils showing up in circuits to this day, which isn't a good thing for APS members buying from circuits that may not have enough expertise on W/F coils. What you're proposing might lead to something workable; just not too sure the APS would be willing to do it.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Moderator
Learn More...
United States
10439 Posts
Posted 01/25/2017   12:58 am  Show Profile Check 51studebaker's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add 51studebaker to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Understood, I too have mostly have given up on APS. But it seems to me that this would be more within reach than directly competing with eBay.

It would basically be a type of insurance, 'seller insurance'. In fact, they already do much of this with memberships, the 'APS Code of Ethics', and dispute resolution. So the idea would only be to expand this as an additional paid service targeted for selling. Like all insurance, they would be playing the odds with the vast majority of transactions not being problematic.

But it is true that there has been a drastic drop off of disciplinary Action by APS in the last few years; they seem to be moving away from this for whatever reason(s). So I agree with you guys, this idea stands virtually no chance of this getting off the ground with them. Of course the odds of them being able to develop a viable competing eBay alternative on a shoe string budget and no in-house IT experience seems to me to be even less likely.

My opinion is that the primary problem here is the complete and total lack of vetting of online sellers. If APS can figure out a way to address this problem by leveraging their good ethical reputation, independent of online venues, they would be able to capitalize on this and breathe new life into the organization.
Don

Edit; John, eBay or other venues don't have participate at all. The seller can form their listings any way they desire. If their listings contain an APS 'Good Housekeeping' seal the other online venues cannot stop them.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United States
650 Posts
Posted 01/25/2017   10:00 am  Show Profile Check kcaramat's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add kcaramat to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I have been a member of APS on at least 2 occassions, but always dropped it because they had nothing of interest for me. Seems kind of sad when the most often stated reason for belonging is as a "donation" or "to support the hobby".

This hobby is screaming for strong leadership! We are not a great diverse demographic, they should be able to zero in on what we need and what we want.

I just can't help myself from drawing comparisons to this situation and what is happening in DC.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United States
663 Posts
Posted 01/25/2017   3:03 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add alub to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
"alub: this one needs to be changed also: http://www.ebay.com/itm/300-312-SHO...AOSwXeJXfxYF notice a trend?"

Sounds like he needs enough "reminders" to make him feel like he cannot get away with "mistakes"

Joe
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Page: of 3 Previous TopicReplies: 31 / Views: 3,658Next Topic  
Previous Page | Next Page
 
To participate in the forum you must log in or register.


Go to Top of Page
Disclaimer: While a tremendous amount of effort goes into ensuring the accuracy of the information contained in this site, Stamp Community assumes no liability for errors. Copyright 2005 - 2022 Stamp Community Family - All rights reserved worldwide. Use of any images or content on this website without prior written permission of Stamp Community or the original lender is strictly prohibited.
Privacy Policy / Terms of Use    Advertise Here
Stamp Community Forum © 2007 - 2022 Stamp Community Forums
It took 0.72 seconds to lick this stamp. Powered By: Snitz Forums 2000 Version 3.4.05