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Overprints On Stamps Of Iran

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Posted 10/06/2018   02:06 am  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add jol34 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
These stamps of 1911 have a warning of many forgeries. Since the catalog value is kind of high, I suspect forgery. Can anyone enlighten me or give me a good link which describes forgeries of Persian stamps. Thank you so much.


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Posted 10/06/2018   03:53 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Climber Steve to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The Persiphila catalogs are your best references, although a bit pricy if you decide to buy. I have the Standard Philatelic Catalogue. www.persi.com Mr. Sadri also does expertizations.

The Relais issue is described on p. 132 of the Standard catalogue, with reference to the original issue found on pp. 127-129. The catalogue is likely on file at the APRL. If you are an APS member, you could arrange for them to copy these pages for you. There may be a small fee. www.stamps.org

As an aside, your first two stamps are the same value. But you have a shade variety with the different red shades.
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Edited by Climber Steve - 10/06/2018 04:20 am
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Posted 10/06/2018   03:54 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Ringo to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I don't know if you will find this freely available on the internet. The guy who does the Big Blue blog has a page on Persian forgeries but doesn't discuss these particular stamps. http://bigblue1840-1940.blogspot.co...nPersia.html

His reference point is the book, "Focus on Forgeries" by Varro Tyler, which sounds good.

I think the stamps above are 1911? Bilingual overprints with French at the top. For some reason they are not listed in my Stanley Gibbons catalogue, although many other overprint types are.
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Posted 10/06/2018   04:00 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Climber Steve to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Ringo: I also have the "revised and expanded" edition of Focus on Forgeries. It lists 5 different stamps or sets from Iran (Persia), but not the stamps shown by jol34.
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Edited by Climber Steve - 10/06/2018 04:13 am
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Posted 10/06/2018   6:01 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add jol34 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The Scott Catalog has them listed as numbers 520-523, type A32, in 1911. According to the notes beneath the listing, they were sold at a 10% discount to stagecoach station keepers and overprinted to prevent speculation. The overprint translates as "stagecoach stations" in French and Farsi. They go on to state that forgeries exist.

Maybe other catalogs don't consider them as true postal items? I will check out the links provided, thanks again.
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Posted 10/06/2018   7:34 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add perf12 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I Believe your stamps have the genuine ovpt. They have a clear ipression. Below a block
from a Feldman auction.Notice the angle in the upper part of the letter. 95% of the
time it is like that.Also notice the different impressions.


Now If you want too have fun ,check this link...and the pics..
http://www.stampsoftheworld.co.uk/w..._1911_Relais
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Edited by perf12 - 10/06/2018 7:45 pm
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Posted 10/07/2018   12:39 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add 91stang to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Good Evening,
As a very informed student of Persia/Iran stamps I would like to start with the basic's:
a. Any stamp from Persia/Iran, year 1909-1911 that is found in mint hinged condition is suspect. Any stamp that is Perf 11.5 x11.5 is very often a reprint. Perforations are critical on this issue. I have written many articles for the ISWSC.org on Persian stamps. Please see their web site
b. Source of info-Iran Classic Philatelic Reference, 2007. M. Sadri
c. Source of info is also, 2018 Ahmad Shah Qajar ebook, M. Sadri. www.persi.com
c. After many years of study, any stamp perf 11.5 is almost certainly a reprint-
d. As seen in the pictures below, genuine stamps are often perf at 11.5 x 11.0-
e. The info privided is a guide. You are welcome to send your stamps in for cert, but it would be a waste of money-
f. Page #117 clearly states, Perf of 12.5 x 12.0.(your first stamp)

g. 1911-1921 The First Portrait Issue of Ahmad Shah, page 118 also states:perf 11.5 x 11.0.

h. Page 30 of the 2018 ebook, mentioned eailer, also shows clear examples of fake handstamps applied to reprints of the 1909 Coat of arms stamps
.

Bottom line: I think you have fake handstamps on reprinted stamps to defraud collectors of their hard earned money-


Lee








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Edited by 91stang - 10/07/2018 1:20 pm
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Posted 10/14/2018   04:24 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add jol34 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Lee, thanks your info and your expertise. I have copied the catalog pages you provided and I will print it up and look at it in more detail. (If that is not a bad thing to do!) Thank you for your post and the link!


Bill
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Posted 11/10/2018   11:07 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add gmot to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Was looking at my collection of a few hundred early Persia today for the first time ever. Hasn't been touched for over 60 years. Astonishing the number of apparent forgeries in the overprints from 1902/1906 I seem to have! It looks like I could have a few authentic ones, but they're the exceptions :)
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Posted 12/05/2018   4:27 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add 91stang to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Please post pic's of the early stuff, if you want-
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Posted 12/05/2018   6:16 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add gettinold to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi

Came across this thread and it made me think of a stamp I found in a collection which aroused my suspicion. Thought I'd post it here hoping for an opinion. I'm far from an expert in the field but thought a more experienced collector would have no trouble knowing the difference between the genuine article and a fake.







The paper this stamp is printed on doesn't seem right to me. It reminds me of the US Confederate forgeries frequently found in collections that were manufactured as album fillers.
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Posted 11/11/2021   12:06 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thread Bumped: Last Post 2 Years ago.

I recall solving this some years ago, lost my information.
Overprint PP ?

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Posted 11/11/2021   06:12 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add hy-brasil to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
From 1899. PP stands for Postes Persanes and was intended as a control. They were never issued. Believe it or not, no forgeries have been reported.

"PP" is heavily impressed and indents the paper. The few I've found also have the basic stamp design also indenting the paper as reported for the reprints of the 1897 issue (Scott: 1898 issue). But I'm guessing a new printing was made for the PP overprints causing the indentation (again).

These were ordered from Enschedé in Belgium who also printed the underlying stamp originally. They include all values of the 1897/1898 issue EXCEPT the 10 kran orange. The 50 kran is rare. Otherwise, the 5ch yellow MH catalogs $3 in Persiphila, otherwise most others catalog $5 as MH with some values up to $30. You don't find sets or even short sets around.

Instead of using this issue, existing stocks of of the 1897/1898 issue were locally overprinted with the Arabesque handstamp overprints (Scott 120-35).
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Edited by hy-brasil - 11/11/2021 06:13 am
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Posted 11/11/2021   06:25 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Chapter and verse !
Thanks HB, top stuff.
I'll print out your commentary for my album page.
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Posted 11/11/2021   06:37 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
For the record, my other two.
The printing does not look like typical letterpress.
Possible forgeries.

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Edited by rod222 - 11/11/2021 06:38 am
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Posted 11/11/2021   06:57 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add hy-brasil to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
They look okay to me. "PP" is still strongly impressed, yes?

If you notice the obvious spotty value tablets in both and some slightly uneven background lines, that's a problem common to all kran values of that original 1897/1898 issue (Scott 113-19) and even the kran values of the later 1899 issue in new colors (Scott 145-51). Again, as a guess, I think the reprints were printed more heavily/stamp paper backed with paper or card when printed to try to eliminate the blotches. Enschedé was able to to get some fully printed value tablets for the reprints but were not entirely successful. So, the reprints are often just less blotchy.

Here's a request: what's the gum look like? Under fluorescent or LED room light, the gum looks peach or pink on what I have. It may be contamination from wherever they were, but I wonder if this is another characteristic.
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Edited by hy-brasil - 11/11/2021 07:07 am
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