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Does Anybody Know What To Make Of This Cover?

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Valued Member
United States
293 Posts
Posted 12/16/2018   08:31 am  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add Reedededge to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
This is neat and visually appealing, but I'm having trouble coming up with any explanation of a genuine usage. No address and a suspect CDS are the two things I immediately noticed. Can anybody chime in on this?:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1918-Regis...AOSwGBRcDaUF
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Pillar Of The Community
Canada
1290 Posts
Posted 12/16/2018   09:48 am  Show Profile Check CanadaStamp's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add CanadaStamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
It's philatelic - a postal "hand back" - and because it carried so much postage it met the requirement for registration. For years - when I collected FDCs I got a registered one along with the single and block. Makes a unique collector's item.
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United States
1008 Posts
Posted 12/16/2018   10:06 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Al E. Gator to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Strictly philatelic item. On my watched items, just to see if someone does buys it.
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Pillar Of The Community
United States
577 Posts
Posted 12/16/2018   10:32 am  Show Profile Check docgfd's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add docgfd to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The cds' are Californian but the corner card is from Massachusetts, making it a bit too contrived for my tastes, even for a 'hand-back,' albeit a pretty visually appealing one. I googled the name on the corner card, half expecting it to belong to a stamp dealer, but it turns out they were tailors.
Its got one bid at $100 already with 7 watchers...
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Moderator
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7703 Posts
Posted 12/16/2018   10:38 am  Show Profile Check 51studebaker's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add 51studebaker to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Hand backs on a registered cover? Would not the PO be hesitant to do this since they had added responsibility to ensure a registered mail piece being tracked? What if the sender purchased indemnity...would the PO just hand back one of those?
Don
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Pillar Of The Community
France, Metropolitan
2426 Posts
Posted 12/16/2018   11:28 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add perf12 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The cancels look similar too the one below,albeit not the same
diameter.?.
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Pillar Of The Community
2462 Posts
Posted 12/16/2018   12:20 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add John Becker to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I would vote for it being a complete fake - and poorly too. It never saw the inside of the post office.

Postmarks are not of any standard postal-made style.
Postmark should not contain a date on the front of a registered letter in this era.
Postmark should be across the flaps on the reverse side.
Registry number is not typically repeated on the reverse side.

Add: For the record for when the internet image in the link above is no longer available:



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Edited by John Becker - 12/16/2018 12:41 pm
Pillar Of The Community
United States
1185 Posts
Posted 12/16/2018   1:43 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Stampman2002 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
While it is visually attractive, it's chance of being legitimate I think is zero.

Others have already pointed out the problems with "hand-backs" and the oddities of the cancel and registration.

I'll add to this fantasy mix the fact that these all appear to be 1909 issue stamps and were unlikely to have still be available in 1918. I really do not like the cancel, either. It's definitely not of the period.

Just my thoughts on it...
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Pillar Of The Community
United States
6322 Posts
Posted 12/16/2018   2:30 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add revcollector to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I agree that is a contrived cover that never saw a post office.
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Canada
1290 Posts
Posted 12/16/2018   2:50 pm  Show Profile Check CanadaStamp's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add CanadaStamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
John - you've convinced me. It's a complete mock-up and as said - never saw a post office. And the postmarks are way too contrived. (have a look at the superfluous one in UL. Think they started to do that and realized to late it was over kill).

PS I don't know rules for USA stationery but should not the envelope also have been cancelled?
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Valued Member
United States
293 Posts
Posted 12/16/2018   3:02 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Reedededge to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Although I am very comfortable with stamp attributions, I am admittedly a novice when it comes to postal history. As I indicated in my OP, this one just didn't feel right. Although an aesthetically pretty cover, I think my suspicions have been confirmed-this appears to be a total fantasy item.
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Edited by Reedededge - 12/16/2018 3:04 pm
Pillar Of The Community
United States
1982 Posts
Posted 12/16/2018   3:08 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add hy-brasil to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
More points against being legitimate:
- Each stamp is carefully cancelled but not the envelope. The forger got tired, perhaps?
- In 1918, Los Angeles, like other cities, had offices identified by name or alphabetic letter in its cancels, nothing generic.
- "R: 01474" There never was "R:" before the registry number as the numbering handstamp could be used for insured mail and special delivery; "REGISTERED" is already struck. And the number here is not changeable as in a handstamp; the "1" is spaced so only a "1" could exist in that position.
- The typeface for the above number is very modern.
- A blacklight on the cancels and markings would reveal this instantly to be a very modern fabrication; i.e., the inks would glow strongly whereas period ink will not.
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Valued Member
United States
417 Posts
Posted 12/16/2018   3:32 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add wtcrowe to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
As per John Williams two volume set on California postmarks, Los Angeles was not using that style in 1918 or any other year. Additionally, I believe that style has been used on fake 1922 series First Day Covers.
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Canada
1290 Posts
Posted 12/16/2018   4:01 pm  Show Profile Check CanadaStamp's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add CanadaStamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Call me cynical. I guessed it would be an anonymous bidder on this - and I was right. If a legitimate collector - too bad they didn't peek in here before they laid down $100
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Valued Member
United States
437 Posts
Posted 12/17/2018   08:05 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add jobi01 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
CanadaStamp said "PS I don't know rules for USA stationery but should not the envelope also have been cancelled?

Per US postal regulations, canceled anywhere on the front is adequate. It was not necessary to cancel the stamp imprint as postal laws forbid the use of cut outs for payment of postage.
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Bill Lehr
US Postal Stationery Specialist
Valued Member
United States
330 Posts
Posted 12/17/2018   08:53 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add m and m to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
as every stamp is poorly centered I would venture to say that if soaked every one of the stamps would possibly show some other form of damage. it is a poor attempt to separate a collector from his money.
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