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Do You Separate - OR Mix The Two "Chinas" ?

 
 
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Pillar Of The Community
United States
1087 Posts
Posted 05/16/2019   06:38 am  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add mobilman44 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
Hi,
I'm in the process of moving a China collection (thru to 1960) from Scott's pages and glassines onto Steiner pages.

All has gone well until I came to the year 1950. At that point, there are "two Chinas" - the Republic of China and the People's Republic of China. Steiner has seen fit (and I agree) to separate the two entities on appropriate labeled pages.

So my question is.... Would you merge the two entities by year, or keep them separate?

Thank you!

Mobilman44
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Pillar Of The Community
United Kingdom
3993 Posts
Posted 05/16/2019   06:47 am  Show Profile Check GeoffHa's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add GeoffHa to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I'd keep them separate. What American catalogues call the "People's Republic of China" - and what others call "China" - should continue from the previous pages. The island state that Chiang Kai Shek established on Formosa is the new entity.
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Valued Member
Ireland
147 Posts
Posted 05/16/2019   07:21 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add FitzjamesHorse to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I treat the Peoples Republic of China as the continuation of China.
I treat Taiwan separately.
As a general rule I prefer countries that are "alive" today. So I have a separate album for "dead" countries...eg Yugoslavia, USSR, South Vietnam, North Vietnam.
I treat German Democratic Republic and Federal Republic as "dead". Likewise Bavaria, Saxony etc but I treat pre war Germany and modern Germany as the same entity.
There is always inconsistency on my part...Tanganyka is dead. Tanzania alive.
I treat Nyassaland as dead. Malawi is the successor...but pre independence Seychelles, Mauritius, India etc are not separate from the modern independent nations.
Dahomey/Benin and Upper Volta/Burkina Faso are the just name changes but are put in the same album under the modern name but I use separate pages.
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Pillar Of The Community
1909 Posts
Posted 05/16/2019   08:29 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Cursus to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I treat the Democratic German Republic and Berlin, as dead countries. But, for me, the Federal German Republic is the líving continuator of pre-war Germany; as it, simply, annexed the Soviet ocuped Germany and Berlin, was a political/postal consequence of this occupation.

As for China,I don't collect it and have no interest on none of them.
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Edited by Cursus - 05/16/2019 08:31 am
Pillar Of The Community
United States
1122 Posts
Posted 05/16/2019   10:33 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Climber Steve to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
When the US first recognized the Peoples' Republic of China, Scott came out with a special Peoples' Republic supplement for its big blue International albums; containing the years 1949 to 1972. I have that supplement.

I still have my China pages as haven't decided yet what to do with them, as I continue downsizing of my worldwide collection. I consider the Republic of China as continuing from pre-World War II times to the Republic based on Taiwan. Which is the opposite of what Fitzjames Horse has done. Bottom line for me: I've kept them separate since they are different countries.
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Edited by Climber Steve - 05/16/2019 10:35 am
Valued Member
United States
63 Posts
Posted 05/16/2019   2:53 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add CL_Arctos to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I separate everything to keep myself from getting confused with the history. So as countries change names or split up and get back together, I keep those entities separate. I also try to leave a note for myself at the beginning of each section to remind me the reasons behind splits/reconciliations and the years they happened. I know it's probably not the way the majority of collectors do it, but it works for me :)
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Valued Member
319 Posts
Posted 05/17/2019   02:40 am  Show Profile Check TangStamps's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add TangStamps to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
That is why the stamps are a history book. Republic of China (ROC) was established in mainland of China after the Qing dynasty was overthrown in 1911 and at that time, Taiwan island is still under the governor of Japan. In 1895, Qing dynasty signed the Treaty of Shimonoseki after they lost war and cede Taiwan to Japan. After world war II, Japan returned Taiwan to China. And Chiang Kai Sek, who was the head of the government and the KMT party, took over Taiwan. However, in the civil war, Chiang Kai Sek lost the war and fled to Taiwan. So Republic of China government is still alive in Taiwan but the mainland is under the control of the communist party and the new government is called PRC. During the first 20+ years after PRC was founded, most of the countries still recognize ROC as the representative of China and ROC is representative of China in the united nation. However, in 1972, PRC replaced ROC in UN. After that, more and more countries started to cut the official diplomatic relationship with ROC and turned to PRC. US did this in year 1979. Currently, still about 20-30 countries have the diplomatic relationship with ROC, and the rest of world recognize PRC. Both sides claim themselves as the legal representative of the whole China, although some local Taiwan people want to be an independent country.
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Edited by TangStamps - 05/17/2019 02:44 am
Pillar Of The Community
United States
1087 Posts
Posted 05/17/2019   05:57 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add mobilman44 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Folks, thanks so much for your views and a great history lesson.

For years I just put China stamps in the Scotts Big Blue and gradually built up a large glassine filled with stamps that "didn't have a designated place" in Scotts. To be honest, the Chinese writing and characters and the massive amount of overprints "scared" me.

About a month ago I found myself scanning the Steiner China and related pages and decided that I would "jump in the deep water" - which I did.

Have to say, the results so far (I'm into the early '50s)are great, and it really gives me a good feeling to have gained the understanding of the many stamps and variants.

Thank you all!
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Valued Member
United Kingdom
158 Posts
Posted Today  1 Hr 12 Min ago  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add steevh to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I've never heard of anyone mixing PRC and Taiwan, except in kiddies' albums where they also get in a some Japan, ROK and DPRK on the same page.
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