Stamp Community Family of Web Sites
Thousands of stamps, consistently graded, competitively priced and hundreds of in-depth blog posts to read
Stamp Community Forum
 
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

Welcome Guest! Need help? Got a question? Inherit some stamps?
Our stamp forum is completely free! Register Now!

Plate Number Coil Stamp Centering

 
 
To participate in the forum you must log in or register.
Author Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  
Pillar Of The Community

Guatemala
1499 Posts
Posted 07/16/2019   2:36 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add quigngt to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
I assume that the centering of the design is the same for sheet and coil stamps. I looked on several PNC websites and found nothing to indicate otherwise, which led to my assumption.

What provoked my question are variations number locations in coils like the 20c Flag which has the number within the design. Then, there are the Transportation coils have numbers partially within the design border, to just below the design, and "dropped plate numbers" that are well below the stamp's design.

Is the location of the plate number is irrelevant to the stamp's centering? Or are there other factors, due to the placement of the plate number, to determine centering for PNCs?

Send note to Staff

Pillar Of The Community
United States
6574 Posts
Posted 07/16/2019   3:20 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Petert4522 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The question you raise came up quite a bit when PNC's first appeared back in 1981. At that time there were two opinions; one camp regarded the plate number as part of the design and others did not. Horizontally the design was supposed to be exactly in the middle - if it was a platenumber strip ( PS ) the joint line should be exactly on the perforations.
Later PNC's do not have a clear joint line any longer; here the design should be centered.
Personally I collect Transportation Coils specialized - I am a 'flyspecker', so centering is less important to me

Peter
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
Learn More...
United States
2563 Posts
Posted 07/16/2019   5:38 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add angore to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I have never seen it mentioned regarding the centering of the plate number itself. I collect PNC's but centering (for any modern material)is not that important to me.

To claim one has an XF condition collection of modern U.S. mint may get one some strange looks.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Al
Edited by angore - 07/16/2019 5:38 pm
Pillar Of The Community
United States
6574 Posts
Posted 07/16/2019   7:08 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Petert4522 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Angore, I probably read it either in "The Plate Number" or in the very early issues of "Coil Line", but I do remember it coming up quite a bit because the joint line ( at that time sometimes called the "Cottrell Line" ) was usually all over the place.

Peter
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Edited by Petert4522 - 07/16/2019 7:09 pm
Pillar Of The Community
Guatemala
1499 Posts
Posted 07/16/2019   7:15 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add quigngt to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks Peter and angora for you comments. I will give a bit more explanation of what I am attempting to find out. The left or right centering is of less concern to me with this post. Nor am I referring to centering of the plate number itself. What I would like to know concerns the vertical centering. The plate number is not part of the design. I need to step back from my comment on the 20c Flag over the Supreme Court. I just checked many online examples and all have the Plt # just below the design border.

I would like to know is this: is the plate number included in the top and bottom vertical centering or is it excluded when determining centering?
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United States
6574 Posts
Posted 07/16/2019   7:31 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Petert4522 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
OK, that is what I meant by the sentence about the two different viewpoints. Some folks feel that the plate number is part of the design and others do not share that opinion.
If you believe that the plate number is not part of the design - more power to you !
As I mentioned earlier, personally I do not care either way. But some folks sell graded ( !! ) strips on eBay and people seem to buy these.

Peter
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United States
2080 Posts
Posted 07/16/2019   10:28 pm  Show Profile Check eyeonwall's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add eyeonwall to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
You might think differently about a numbered single stamp, but in a strip of 5 you have 4 without the number and only 1 with it and the number is relatively small (particularly for the one or two digit numbers), So the visually effect of the plate number on the centering of the strip is minimal. So I just go with the main design being centered (and then maybe "cheat" just a little to consider the plate number if you want).
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United States
2080 Posts
Posted 07/16/2019   10:32 pm  Show Profile Check eyeonwall's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add eyeonwall to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Peter - "if it was a platenumber strip ( PS ) the joint line should be exactly on the perforations"
I think this was chosen to make it easy to define horizontal centering, but the fact is the joint line is often not exactly half way between the two stamp designs that are on either side of it, so if you get the line dead center in the perfs, the stamp designs are not dead center between the perfs. It is a tricky situation with no perfect answer.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
Guatemala
1499 Posts
Posted 07/16/2019   10:52 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add quigngt to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Sorry to have misunderstood your comment on the two camps. When you wrote "At that time there were two opinions", I took it to mean there are no longer two opinions in our time. My mistake. As for taking the side of those who do not believe it to be part of the design ... well I would expect the plate number to be on every stamp if it were part of the design. Plus, if it is part of the design there would be at least two designs; one with and one without the number. The number would be a deliberate change in the design not an unintended variation. I suppose one could argue successfully for the second opinion. Anyway, not part of the design is what makes sense to me.

If there is no consensus to this day, then one person's VF would be another's F. I'd say that makes its bit messy to grade PNCs.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
  Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  
 
To participate in the forum you must log in or register.


Go to Top of Page
Disclaimer: While a tremendous amount of effort goes into ensuring the accuracy of the information contained in this site, Stamp Community assumes no liability for errors. Copyright 2005 - 2019 Stamp Community Family - All rights reserved worldwide. Use of any images or content on this website without prior written permission of Stamp Community or the original lender is strictly prohibited.
Privacy Policy / Terms of Use    Advertise Here
Stamp Community Forum © 2007 - 2019 Stamp Community Forums
It took 0.2 seconds to lick this stamp. Powered By: Snitz Forums 2000 Version 3.4.05