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1912 Persia Overprint

 
 
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Posted 08/24/2019   5:41 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add SaborStamp to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
I found this in a feeder album. I assume it's one of the abundant Persia forgeries. It seems to match the illustration in my Scott Catalog, though, so I'm hoping somebody here might be able to tell me how to identify it for sure. Thanks!
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Posted 08/24/2019   8:07 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add hy-brasil to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Not a common forgery but still a forgery, unfortunately.

The overprint is incorrect per the Persiphila catalog. Also, the cancel must be from SENNEH but the cancel shows the letter "N" in the wrong position for that. Most importantly, the cancel shows "15" which in this cancel type means it's a 1915 cancel, impossible for the overprinted stamp.
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Posted 08/24/2019   8:49 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add SaborStamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thank you very much Hy-Brasil!
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Posted 08/24/2019   9:38 pm  Show Profile Check 91stang's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add 91stang to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Hello!
excellent info above-
Lets see if I can help





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Posted 08/25/2019   07:49 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add SaborStamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks very much 91stang! I'm always impressed by the wealth of knowledge in the group and the willingness to share it. You and hy-brasil provided me with great information on this stamp.
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Posted 08/25/2019   8:39 pm  Show Profile Check 91stang's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add 91stang to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Here's one cover for $1,200.00 euro's--

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Posted 08/26/2019   12:27 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add EMaxim to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks here too to both hy-brasil and 91stang. Very helpful info.
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Posted 08/31/2019   11:37 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add agb to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Just noticed this thread which prompted me to look at my 'dubious' stamps of Persia

The scan below could be of a genuine overprint, the partial postmark may be 'Senneh'?



Not sure if the overprinted stamp and the portrait obliterated was specially made for the 'stamp packet trade'?

I would appreciated your comments

Andrew
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Edited by agb - 08/31/2019 12:20 pm
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Posted 08/31/2019   3:04 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add funcitypapa to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Based on numerous threads i'm Starting to think that it makes sense to assume all Persian singles are counterfeit until proven otherwise. For me personally, the expense of certification is not worth it.
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Posted 08/31/2019   3:10 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add agb to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I totally agree with you.

Maybe its time to collect re-prints and forgeries, which I am leaning towards having read a lot of the threads relating to Persian stamps.

Andrew
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Posted 08/31/2019   7:59 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add hy-brasil to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
The scan below could be of a genuine overprint, the partial postmark may be 'Senneh'?

You have been given everything you need to separate genuine from forgeries and only pick on one factor? That's not how it's done, ever. A suspicious person might think you are you just trying to get someone to do all the identification for you.


Quote:
Not sure if the overprinted stamp and the portrait obliterated was specially made for the 'stamp packet trade'?

Asking for confirmation of a very bad guess using a negative conditional is being coy. This question contains an assumption so wrong that others can assume a logical explanation would probably not be found acceptable.


Quote:
Based on numerous threads i'm Starting to think that it makes sense to assume all Persian singles are counterfeit until proven otherwise.

First, Scott gives you a good guide as to which issues are forged and which are not. While not absolutely complete (CTOs, worth much less for better stamps, are not explained), reprints are often explained clearly.

Second, A genuine 1kr or 2ch stamp of this issue is worth about $500 or more, probably the equivalent rarity of a US stamp worth $1500. SaborStamp is absolutely correct in being skeptical.

Third, consider that the majority of forged Iran stamps posted on SCF are likely from beginner to intermediate collections or accumulations where forgeries of better stamps ($10 up to rarities) are common. It is not optimistic to think you've bought a rarity for a song but rather bordering on delusional unless you are an absolute beginner. Consider all the intermediate collections with US classics reperfed or repaired, and with forged Washington-Franklin coils. Not a lot of difference there.

Fourth, if Iranian forgeries were a concern, you'd buy the Persiphila catalog shown or the cheaper 2002 abbreviated catalog, perhaps a better choice for the non-specialist.

I can understand the frustration but earlier US is a minefield, too.


Quote:
For me personally, the expense of certification is not worth it.

Nor is it for me for stamps less than several hundred dollars in value. But you can still educate yourself on what is genuine and what is not.


Quote:
Maybe its time to collect re-prints and forgeries, which I am leaning towards having read a lot of the threads relating to Persian stamps.

How can this be done if you won't bother to learn the differences between those and genuine stamps?
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Posted 09/01/2019   03:36 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add agb to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
hy-brazil, Thank you for your valued comments

Apologies to readers if my contribution to this thread has caused some concern. What I thought was a simple question as I am a beginner in this area of philately and have been putting aside Iranian overprinted stamps that come my way to study at a later date.

The only catalogue I use at present is the SG version, I will look into obtaining the Persiphila range of catalogues. I am only interested in the forgery aspect, the overprints and secondly re-prints, thats why I put this stamp aside as it was partially obliterated with a blue crayon and I could not find any references to such obliterations so my assumption was 'forgery'.

Andrew
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Posted 09/03/2019   04:56 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add agb to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Yesterday I downloaded an e-Book from the website www.persi.com.
The book I choose was 'Persiphila Qajar Philatelic Reference (c.1865-1925) 2007 edition, which also contains amendments.
The catalogue is very easy to use with excellent clarity of the overprints etc.

Highly recommended!

Andrew
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Edited by agb - 09/03/2019 06:11 am
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Posted 09/03/2019   5:23 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Climber Steve to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
"Highly recommended......." I agree. Good decision. I have the Persiphila 2002 print catalogue.
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