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What Is This 70 Stamp - 70B Steel Blue Or 70d

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Valued Member
United States
94 Posts
Posted 12/26/2019   07:45 am  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add BlackJack2271 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
Poll Question:
While soon awaiting PF certification of this stamp
Why not have a community poll to see what each
of us following this thread thinks. So what is it
70b Steel Blue or 70d Pale Gray Violet?



Choices:
70b
70d
None of the above

(Anonymous Vote)
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Pillar Of The Community
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549 Posts
Posted 12/26/2019   08:24 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add SPQR to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
how about a none of the above option?
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Posted 12/26/2019   08:29 am  Show Profile Check 51studebaker's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add 51studebaker to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Good idea, I added the option.
Don
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94 Posts
Posted 12/31/2019   08:04 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add BlackJack2271 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Just wondering, those that voted none of the above what Scott# do you think this stamp is?
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Posted 12/31/2019   11:29 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Caper123 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
78?
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Posted 12/31/2019   11:49 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add BlackJack2271 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
But it has thin paper and 78 was not printed on thin paper.
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Posted 12/31/2019   11:57 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rogdcam to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thin paper is a continuous refrain in these threads and seems to be an all important factor in identification. Just how is thin paper in this case being defined? Has it been measured or is this purely a subjective conclusion/description?
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Posted 12/31/2019   2:38 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add BlackJack2271 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The design is clearly visible from the back.
The paper thickness is 0.0065 mm.
That is why I am calling it thin paper.
Correct me if I am wrong.
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Posted 12/31/2019   8:02 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Caper123 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I can't correct you as I have no idea the proper thickness. I tested 2 of my 78's. One was .008, the other .009, so yours seems thin in comparison, but then again there was a .001 mm difference between the 2 of mine so some variation is normal I guess. Is there a standard thickness or range of thickness for thin paper?
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Posted 12/31/2019   8:25 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rogdcam to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
From the USPCS:

Papers of the 1860s Issue Stamps

In 1860, domestic cotton rags made up 70% of the raw material used for paper, largely from cotton mills. The Civil War cut off cotton supplies and paper prices rose sharply while quality was degraded in the later 1861 stamp printings. The 1861 National banknote issue premiere gravure essays were printed on a very thin, transparent paper that cracks easily. It measures about .65-.75 mils in thickness. The regular issue paper used for the first 97 shipments was initially a thin translucent hard paper measuring .70-.75mils until January 1862 at which time it shifted to medium thickness paper measuring .80-.85 mils.


http://www.nystamp.org/postal-histo...ic-is-paper/
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241 Posts
Posted 01/01/2020   10:11 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Germania to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
0.65 - 0.85 mils thick paper is approximately 0.02 mm. A hair is approximately 0.08 mm thick. Collectors measuring 0.0065 mm or 0.008 mm should check their units.
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94 Posts
Posted 01/01/2020   1:28 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add BlackJack2271 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
As referenced from my other post about my 70 stamp, according to SIEGEL auction description I learned that
70b, 70c and 70d were printed on thin crisp paper in early 1861 printings. Prob. Aug. and Sept. 1861.

"Pale Gray Violet shade, Scott 70d, comes from an early 1861 printing on thin paper, a characteristic shared by the Violet and Steel Blue stamps."

Anyone know more about this?
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434 Posts
Posted 01/01/2020   3:16 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add mootermutt987 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Standard answer: Hard to tell the color because scanners differ. Online scans are notoriously undependable.

Having said that, I would say it is not even close to Steel Blue. My impression of Pale Gray Violet is that it is 'warmer' than the color of your stamp. It could be some sub-shade of the #70, but my bet would be on one of the shades of #78 - knowing paper thickness would add a lot to the convo.

I hesitatingly voted "none of the above". I hope I am wrong!

It'll be interesting to see how it comes back from the PF.
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Edited by mootermutt987 - 01/01/2020 3:18 pm
Valued Member
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Posted 01/10/2020   09:53 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add BlackJack2271 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
A quick update. PF certification delayed as the stamp
was sent to an outside expert for opinion. There must be
a difference of opinion among the several NY experts as to
what variety it is. If you still have not voted you still
have plenty of time.
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Valued Member
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Posted 01/21/2020   2:02 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add BlackJack2271 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I spoke with PF today.
Those of you who voted
"Other " as in 78 will be wrong
as he stated the stamp will one
of the 70 color varieties.
Just an update. Please vote
if you haven't done so.
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Valued Member
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94 Posts
Posted 01/23/2020   1:57 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add BlackJack2271 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
??? Another "other" vote.
78 does not have thin paper.
Decision has to be between 70b or 70d.
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