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Show Your US 1851-57 Imperforate Stamps

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Posted 03/07/2023   11:21 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add mootermutt987 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
That's a tough call, Stan. Yeah, the crease/tear are fairly obvious and should have been mentioned. OTOH, that is as fresh a looking gash-on-shoulder variety as you are likely to see in quite a while. I don't know if it is a poorly-wiped plate or not, but there almost appears to be some doubling of the bottom frame line, midway between this and the next stamp down. - mostly obscured by the cancel. The impression of this example is quite good.

I have dealt with Momen a few times. You will pay top dollar. No doubt. Especially for the high-grade stuff. Other than pricing, I don't have any complaints. And pricing is what keeps him (and all dealers) in business. As long as he can find buyers.
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Posted 03/16/2023   10:41 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rlsny to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Two stamps I'm looking for assistance on.

The first is just a rather nice looking 3c stamp with good color. Could it be OB?

The second is a 1c that appears to be a type II, but hoping someone could give the thumbs up or down on that.

Thanks!


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United States
382 Posts
Posted 03/17/2023   12:12 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add ioagoa to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi RLSNY --

Your 3-cent imperf with the black NY year dated cancel is position 3L8 -- which makes it a Scott #11.

As an aside -- in the process of plating your stamp -- I discovered that the Lund stamp currently slotted as position 3L8 on StampPlating.com is not correct. I have not plated it yet -- but it is not position 3L8.

If you did want to compare your stamp to a confirmed reference copy -- there is a very nice example of position 3L8 in the StampSmarter database. Likewise, there is also the Chase photo -- albeit not the best quality.

Regards // ioagoa
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Posted 03/17/2023   1:07 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rlsny to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks ioagoa. They are always 11s, but one of these days ...

Now hoping someone can make an attempt on the 1c Franklin. Though admittedly it is a hard case. I might have to trust my instincts.
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Posted 03/17/2023   8:05 pm  Show Profile Check sinclair2010's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add sinclair2010 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The 1c stamp is a Type II, as you suspected. I can't guarantee it but I suspect it is 91R1E. Whatever it is, it is a bottom row stamp from Plate 1E and it is a Type II.
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Posted 03/17/2023   9:26 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rlsny to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thank you. Great information. Always appreciated.
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Posted 03/31/2023   9:03 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add stanshepp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Hey all!

I have one to share that I am having a little bit of trouble nailing down.

Here is the stamp and the cover that it is attached to. It is a little bit stained, but I am thinking that it is July of 1851. No date on the folded letter.

Also, is there any safe way to clean up a letter such as this?

Any guidance is sure appreciated.

Thanks!
Stan Shepp


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Stan Shepp
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Posted 04/01/2023   12:15 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add ioagoa to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Hey Stan --

Your stamp that is on the cover with the red July 10 Newbury VT cds (stamp tied with a black circular grid) is position 97R1L.

This is an interesting stamp -- as position 97R1 was the subject of a USPCS Chronicle article titled -- "New Plate Flaw Discovery: "Dash and Ink Trail" on 3 1851 Stamp" -- authored by Charles DiComo (see USPCS Chronicle #259).

Although your scan is not the best -- probably due to the SCF file size limitations -- I believe that I can see the remnants of the "dash" in the white space between the TLB and URDB -- which further confirms the plating.

As an aside -- based on the published EKU dates -- a July 10, 1851 usage would have to be from 1E or 1i -- or would be a newly discovered EKU. Your stamp is not from the Early or Intermediate state of plate 1 -- as both 97R1E and 97R1i do not have the LIL recut.

Still a nice usage of this plate variety -- despite the staining.

Regards // ioagoa
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Posted 04/01/2023   01:19 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add stanshepp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I'm going to show Charles and see what he thinks. :)

I'm sure that he will be excited to tell me more about it.

Thanks!

EDIT: Charles said: "we looked at 43 97R1L state and none showed the complete "dot and dash," - lost when plate 1i was re-entered to produce 1L."
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Stan Shepp
Edited by stanshepp - 04/01/2023 12:04 pm
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Posted 04/01/2023   12:42 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add ioagoa to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi Stan --

A bit of follow-up on your last edit -- Charles is correct in that the "complete" dot and dash flaw will not show on the late state of the plate. In other words -- most -- but not all -- of the dot and dash flaw was lost when 1i was reworked to become 1L -- but on clearly printed copies, the remnant of the flaw is visible in the white space between the TLB and URDB -- and despite the limitations of the scan quality in your original post -- I believe that I can see this feature on your patient stamp.

I am attaching 2 images below to show the area where the remnants of the flaw can be seen. The first image is of the entire stamp -- an early printing impression of position 97R1L -- surely used Feb 1852 -- and the second image is cropped to show the remnant of the flaw.

Regards // ioagoa




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Edited by ioagoa - 04/01/2023 12:45 pm
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Posted 04/09/2023   11:05 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add stampcrow to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
In Simpson's U.S. Postal Markings there's only a handful of straight line cancels with the month and day dangling alone. I realize Simpson's catalogue might only show a fraction of the possible cancels so identifying this one might not be possible.
But here I am.
I measured the height of the digit 1 as 3mm.
Any thoughts?
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Edited by stampcrow - 04/09/2023 11:06 am
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Posted 04/09/2023   4:51 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add ioagoa to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi StampCrow,

I am away from my stamps this weekend (visiting the grandkids for the Easter holiday), but a couple of preliminary observations on your stamp with the straight line cancel.

Based on the strength of the frame lines and the fact that there are no inner lines that were re-cut I am reasonably certain that your stamp is from either plate 6 or plate 7 both of which have an "earliest known use" date in February 1856. So for starters, you may be able use the Feb 1856 date to help identify and/or eliminate possibilities. My guess is that your stamp was probably used in Jan 1857 (could be later but Jan 1858 is getting late for the imperfs)?

In the Chase book, starting on page 245, he discusses the various straight line cancels that he observed in the course of his studies and also provides a listing along with a written description of each so you may want to check that out for possibilities. Unfortunately, Chase only provided illustrations for a very few of those he noted. That said, once you know the name of the various towns, you could check the usual data bases for images and see if anything matches your patient.

That's all the help that I can offer you for now, which isn't very much, but at least it's something.

Good luck with the hunt as those unframed straight line cancels are really scarce!!

Regards // ioagoa

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Edited by ioagoa - 04/09/2023 4:56 pm
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Posted 04/09/2023   10:01 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add stampcrow to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Ioagoa thank you.
I feel a bit foolish that I hadn't consulted the Chase book before posting.
Having now read Dr Chase's descriptions only one seems a possibility. Ringville, Mass is described as "all in one straight line". He doesn't give any dimensions. I Googled Ringville Straightline cancel and one result comes up from SAN previous auction. It's an 11A on cover with the Ringville straight line cancel but the part of the cancel that is the date doesn't show well enough to make a comparison.

As for those listed in the Simpson catalogue, there are two I see that could fit. One is Clermont, NY which has no picture and the other is Uvalde, Tex. with an example that is Oct 2. Google search.., no Clermont, NY but I did find an example of the Uvalde, Tex on a Nesbit cover. As with the Ringville example I don't think it provides clear proof.

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Edited by stampcrow - 04/09/2023 10:08 pm
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Posted 04/09/2023   10:06 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add stampcrow to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

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Posted 04/12/2023   01:04 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add stanshepp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Hey all!

I've been super busy lately, but I took a moment to prepare this to share. I spent 45 minutes plating this - just to find that it was already plated. Good news - we agreed.

For your viewing pleasure.

Stan Shepp

3c Orange Brown, Ty. II (10A). Position 40L2E, large margins to clear including part of adjoining stamp at top, tied by blue Star in Circle fancy cancel, matching "Charlottesville Va. Dec. 18" (1851) circular datestamp on blue folded letter to Wilmington P.O. Va., receipt docketing at top also confirms year of use, Very Fine and choice, a scarce fancy cancel, ex-Haas and Lord.

This stamp is 4 four complete margins and as crisp and clean of a printing as one could ask for. That blue star could have been struck cleaner...

Speaking of the blue star - Simpson's has a Charlottesville 5-Pointed Star listed & it is labeled "L12-18", the description at the beginning of this section says that an L12 is an "Encircled or decorated star" and the number to the right of the "L" number indicates the approximate significant dimension in millimeters, such as the diameter of a circle, side of a square, across points of a star, etc. - This one is 18mm across. No qualifier on color is givern in Simpson's.

It looks like the listing example had some issues in being clear as well. I am not convinced that they are exactly the same cancel, but they are close enough for now.





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