Bill Langs Passed Away

None of this passes the common sense test. Kelleher cannot produce a catalog without resting assured that the stamps can change hands through their auction. They have to have the stamps in hand. Period. Coogle cannot be standing there checking with Max as to whether or not the lot exists. That would be crazy. It would not work.

So then maybe the problem is HipStamp

Crazier still if you put an item in your cart you can pay for it. And then what happens........

It'll be interesting to see how long the lots last on eBay/HipStamps AFTER the Kelleher auction. Perhaps the EASIEST thing to do (and pretty scuzzy, at that) is to simply leave everything up at eBay/HipStamps. Leaving them there = zero effort. Removing them from there = effort.

The declined offer may have been a way of saying- "We're no longer accepting any bids/offers."

Probably leaving the items there until after the Auction. The items that sale will be removed. The items that don't sell will stay and probably be reduced. It's a no cost way of doing it. If they removed everything and then reposted the items they have left then they'd have to pay listing fees. I bet if you tried to purchase an item listed right now they have some generic email that says "sorry, item is pending sale".
All this is just speculation on my part...

Exactly this. There's nothing to prevent someone from buying any of the items listed, at which point depending on how far someone wanted to push the issue, potential legal entanglements for the estate ensue: "I don't give a d*mn who the material was consigned to. I bought and paid for XXXXX at the asking price. As the platform policy states, this consitutes a legally binding contract and obligation upon both the buyer and seller. I want the XXX that I paid for!"

I'm shocked that the listings are all still up on eBay and Hipstamp. The instant consignment was agreed upon, those listings should have come down, and if not then, the moment the physical possession of the goods changed hands.

Yikes.

eBay policy requires that the actual physical location of the item be fully disclosed in the listing; if the material has been moved from the original listing location then the listing is in violation.

https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/...licy?id=4244

Don

If Kelleher had all of the stamps at hand before producing the catalog, they must have produced it in August. I bought the stamp below (lot 2285), in a direct negotiation with Bill Langs' office, the 1st week of September. But it is anyone's guess whom I was actually buying from. Perhaps Kelleher was in actual control of the stamp when Langs' office gave me word that my offer was accepted. I suppose this is a real possibility because Kelleher listed the stamp correctly as Position 48R2 whereas Langs had it listed as a 78R2.

I'm convinced that the auction houses in reality are just dealers with another name. Sometimes is is their own material they are selling. Otherwise, they accept consignments and then deal with consignors and buyers in whatever way is agreeable to both parties. The terms and agreements of their auctions seems to spell out their right to do so.

Somebody asked earlier about fees - on Hipstamp no fees until sold, then they take their cut, so items can be left forever. Currently, most of the 63 thousand+ items are on sale and 220 have been added this month, so someone is actively managing the listings on eBay/HS.

It is becoming much clearer in my mind what I believe is going on. I think that Kelleher now has a ready-made Ebay/Hipstamp store. It only makes sense. Having two parties offer the same material at auction and online would be an utter coordination nightmare between what is available and what funds are owed whom and what fees go where etc.. They did not have to build from scratch. Langs has a well known brand, for better or worse, that has a value, a huge inventory and an established record with massive feedback ratings. I may be wrong but I do not think so.

Lorry's buying experience brought clarity to this. There is no other way to explain it. Watch for the store to keep running and inventory be added. With Kelleher running the show it is no big deal to withdraw a lot if purchased elsewhere. The sticky wicket would be if there was a run on stamps in the online stores and Kelleher started an auction by announcing 200 lots as withdrawn. Not likely though.

Except that transferring eBay accounts is against eBay policy, if someone reports them the store will be taken down unless Kelleher can prove they purchased Langs entire business. (Buying the inventory is not the same as buying the business.)
Don

51studebaker - I rarely differ with you, but I think eBay and Hipstamp are both a big joke when it comes to enforcing their policies. Both companies surely know that their major listers sell the same material at both sites as well as privately. They may claim that any buyer who has first viewed material one their respective sites is their customer, but how can they enforce that? In truth, I don't know of a single dealer who won't sell to me directly regardless of where they have listed a stamp. Both eBay and Hipstamp try to prevent communication between seller and buyer outside of their platforms, but dealers still blatantly advertise, "Please contact me directly if you are dissatisfied". So how is that barrier going to work except by intimidation? I have to believe that as long as a major seller is making money for eBay or Hipstamp, they are going to tolerate the revenue leakage because it's just too hard to stop.

No worries. I think we are largely on the same page; I agree that eBay has no real way to vet any account other than doing a few simple online checks. Obviously eBay will never be able to send anyone out to verify a physical address.

My point was that if Kelleher has indeed 'taken over' the old Langs account they would be blatantly breaking eBay rules, this would not be good optics for a reputable company. I also assume that if this was happening, and a buyer complained about the 'location' being incorrect (which is easily provable) or if someone sends eBay evidence that BL has died and his store is no longer active by him or his estate (with the inventory moved), then eBay would take action.

It might also be that the Langs store was pre-paid for a period a time, perhaps for a year at time.
Don

@widglo46 Can't speak to eBay, but Hipstamp has absolutely no issues with selling stamps on other platforms that are also listed on HS. In fact, they have created & promote bulk listing synchronization tools specifically designed to sync listings between HS and eBay or Delcampe.

~Greg