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Germany Used Block Of 10 Postmarked 1923

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Valued Member
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Posted 09/08/2020   5:16 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add Linus to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
Scanned below is a German block from my WW block collection. In the Scott Catalogue, this is Germany #305, postally used block of 10, serrate roulette 13.5 perforations, 2019 catalogue value $7.50 each stamp, $75 for ten stamps. I would like opinions from members who specialize in the German inflation period...

Is this cancel real or fake?

What would be a fair price for this block?

Thanks in advance,
Linus



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Posted 09/08/2020   7:04 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add bookbndrbob to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Linus, a Germany specialist would in all likelihood buy this item with the intention of sending it to Germany to be expertized. This is not an inexpensive process by any means.

So, that would be somewhat of a "downdraft" on your selling price...unless you wish to hold on to it for quite some time.
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Posted 09/08/2020   7:42 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Linus to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Yes, I realize that the only way to be sure is to send it to the experts in Germany, and I realize it is expensive, so I will never do it. I was just looking for opinions from our club members, so I will change my question to multiple choice:

Is this cancel real or fake?

A. Looks OK, but needs expertized.

B. Does not look right, but needs expertized.

C. Definitely looks fake.

Thanks in advance to anyone who has some knowledge in this area,

Linus
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Posted 09/08/2020   8:15 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add floortrader to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Doesn't look good .
Looks like it was canceled in the Domanician Republic by what's his name .....gee....forgot his name over the last 45 years .

I never seen a specialist here who knows German Inflation Issues .
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Posted 09/08/2020   9:06 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add PostmasterGS to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Michel CV is 10 € per stamp used. This is not a rare inflation issue to find used. The cancel appears correct and is period appropriate. Probably worth about 15-20 €.
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Presenting the GermanStamps.net Collection - Germany, Colonies, & Occupied Territories, 1872-1945
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Posted 09/10/2020   01:40 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add cupram to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I did not find on "phila stempel.de" an obliteration with the name MUENCHEN. Is there?
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Posted 09/10/2020   02:26 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add PostmasterGS to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Try the stampsx.com database. There are dozens that were used in Münich from the early 1900s to 1930s.
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Presenting the GermanStamps.net Collection - Germany, Colonies, & Occupied Territories, 1872-1945
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Posted 09/10/2020   05:10 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add cupram to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks PostmasterGS.Excelent site (even if the German translation is partial)
I checked a MANNHEIM cancel that I think is genuine. My hypothesis (most opinions from other collectors-fake cancel) is that the number of the month was set incorrectly: 1 instead of 11. I have seen situations (on the envelope) when the date the deposit was later to the date of receipt.
Any opinion from you is very helpful for me.

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Posted 09/10/2020   08:10 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add floortrader to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Most collectors don't have extensive collections of cancellations of the inflation period of Germany .

To be good you need ,covers and thousands of examples of cancels from the various post offices of that period . I am looking for that type of cancel in that time period and finding nothing ,so as I said ,it doesn't look good .

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Posted 09/10/2020   09:23 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add PostmasterGS to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Mannheim 1 used two "* 1 S" cancellers of the "circle/bridge with two segments" type shown in your image. The first was from about 1916-1920, and the second in mid- to late 1923, though provisional uses outside that short time period are known. Yours is the second type, so the canceller style is generally correct for the year. The bigger problem is, as you noted above, the month. That stamp wasn't available until 27 October 1923. It's either a mis-set month or a forgery.

Another reason to think it's a forgery -- if it is a mis-set month, the correct month could only be November (the stamp wasn't available on 19 October 1923, and the Mark revaluation occurred on 1 December 1923, ruling out 19 December 1923). On 19 November 1923 the basic letter rate was 5 Milliarden Mark, so it would have taken 50 stamps of that denomination to make the correct rate.
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Presenting the GermanStamps.net Collection - Germany, Colonies, & Occupied Territories, 1872-1945
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Posted 09/10/2020   12:59 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add cupram to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks floortrader and PostmasterGS.
I am glad that the obliteration looks like the one used at that time.
The stamps are printed flat (HAN number H-5888.23) on October 28, 1923 and valid ("gultig" according to Michel 2011) until December 31, 1923.
A counterfeit cancellation I think has different dimensions from the original (letters, numbers, circles)
I am curious if a German expert agrees to examine only the obliteration and to certify it from a dimensional point of view and not from the period of use and the type of stamp.
If the cancellation is original I think the only logical conclusion is that the month number was set wrong.
I insist on this block of stamps because I noticed that in Michel 2011 it does not have a price evaluation yet and I suspect that it is rare.
Thank you again.

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Posted 09/10/2020   1:07 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add bookbndrbob to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Unless I am wrong, I believe we have been through this specific item previously.
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Romania
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Posted 09/10/2020   2:51 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add cupram to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
You're right bookbndrbob; hornet and you answered me.
I was also very interested in the opinion of other collectors and especially PostmasterGS.
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Posted 09/10/2020   5:03 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add codehappy to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Forged cancels are a lesser problem than favor cancels on most of these stamps, really.

Collectors and dealers got many of these inflation issues cancelled at the local P.O. with genuine postmarks, but they never carried mail. If they are out of period, the philatelic nature of the cancel is clear, but a favor cancel in the correct period may not be distinguishable from an off-cover genuine postal use.
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Posted 09/10/2020   6:51 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add floortrader to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
#### I GIVE UP ####-----How much dumb information can be put on this page .
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Posted 09/11/2020   04:08 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add cupram to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I'm sorry floortrader. I'm a novice collector and I think my questions are often bad and boring for many of those with experience.
"codehappy" gave me a logical answer: favor genuine cancel fraudulently applied by a postal employee.
I suspect that this happened in the years 1923 (PostmasterGS stated that the camcel was used for a short time) and therefore I ask 2 more stupid questions:
-Genuine favor cancel with wrong time? It doesn't make sense.
-I do not think that at that time the collectors had a correct evaluation of the higher future value for the canceled stamps.
Thank you "codehappy"for the logical answer and for your kindness in answering some silly questions
Thank you "floortrader" for posting your canceled stamps collection of Inflation Period.
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