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Canada Small Queen 3 Cent - Perf Variety

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Canada
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Posted 10/31/2020   12:18 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Trodent to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Query?

Does anyone have any idea where that cork cancellation might have been used?

It is not much of cancel, BUT?

Trodent
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Posted 10/31/2020   03:07 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add archerg to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Many of those cut geometric corks come from Ottawa, there are dozens of variants.
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Posted 10/31/2020   10:49 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add jogil to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
If the stamp was potentially from 1870 due to the 12.5 perforation, then it would mostly have been a 1st Ottawa printing. The 12.5 appears to have been mostly intended for some revenue stamps but some regular postage stamps also got perforated 12.5 somehow.
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Edited by jogil - 10/31/2020 10:53 am
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Canada
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Posted 12/21/2020   10:52 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Trodent to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Disappointing News!!!

Sent stamp to get certified and it came back as REPERFED on top and bottom



Trodent
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Posted 12/22/2020   03:39 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Sympathy with your result.
Praise for you for posting the certificate, not many do ! Bravo.
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Posted 12/22/2020   04:21 am  Show Profile Check 51studebaker's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add 51studebaker to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thank you for the follow up, sorry for the news.

I note that not a single person who posted in this thread (many of whom I consider knowledgeable Canadian collectors) even mentions the possibility of a reperf and instead opined that it was a new, unusual and/or uncommon perforation.

For US stamps most folks would have immediately raised the possibility of a reperf because the likelihood of a reperf is so high. Are SQ (or other Canadian stamps of this era) reperfs or altered stamps uncommon? Does VG publish information on the frequency of altered Canadian stamps they see? How do Canadian collectors educate themselves to make informed buying decisions and avoid altered stamps or are altered Canadian stamp very uncommon?
Don
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Posted 12/22/2020   08:57 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add wert to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Kudos for trying Trodent
Wish you had got better news.

Robert
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Posted 12/22/2020   11:05 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add jogil to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
51studebaker: I have read the excellent book "How To Detect Damaged, Altered and Repaired Stamps" by Paul W Schmid. In it, it shows many characteristics of reperforated stamps. Since this stamp's horizontal perforations show more realistic physical characteristics of perforations made by a rotary perforator rather than those made by a stroke perforator from which reperforations are mostly made, it can be easy to overlook this. However, taking such a common stamp and
reperforating it horizontally using a Rosback Pony rotary perforator (12.5) would seem like a lot of work to do. Also, the Rosback would have smaller pin diameters.
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Edited by jogil - 12/22/2020 11:23 am
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Posted 12/22/2020   11:16 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add wert to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
How did someone get this common stamp reperforated horizontally with a Rosback Pony rotary perforator?


Jogil..That is not what I am worrying about...Take a look at the top perf margin..Quite big...Must have has a HUGE margin for some one to re-perf...Some thing is not right here...

Just saying.
Rober
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Canada
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Posted 12/22/2020   11:16 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Lars714 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi Don - that is an interesting question. Though some may have wondered, it seems that out of respect for the integrity of the collector, we didn't "pile on" when this potential variety was reported. Is this a Canadian-ism, possibly. I had my doubts about the report, but only because I had never heard about this perf.

I wonder about the reperf assessment, but as I am not an expert, I keep my opinions to myself. I was hoping that the assessment would come back as good news, as it would help energize collectors to continue the search for that perf holy grail that we all hope is out there (but know deep inside likely doesn't exist).

I don't purchase perf varieties. I accumulate and search, compiling a database of perf populations for my own use and interest - over 2000 37/41 logged and growing. Gives an interesting sample of the perf varieties.

Chris

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Posted 12/22/2020   11:47 am  Show Profile Check 51studebaker's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add 51studebaker to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi Chris,
A couple of thoughts on this thread. It is possible to machine a perforator and crank out reperfs, this has been done both in the past and is being done now. Are the existing vintage Rosback Pony rotary perforators all accounted for or could they have gotten into private hands over the years? There are countless examples of low value US stamps being reperfed, typically they were used for practice by the unethical reperforators.

I repeat the same questions as above, how common are reperforated Canadian stamps? In the US tens of thousands of stamps have been reperforated over the years. I assume that some of this is due to the fact that many US stamp panes have straight edges but as far as I know SQs did not have straight edges. if so, then it would make sense that SQ reperfs would be somewhat less likely but obviously not impossible. .

I agree that the stamp in question appears to have legitimate horizonal perfs to my hobbyist eye and from the images. The holes looked ok to me as well as the fibers and I even thought I saw a few pressure ridges. But the VG folks had the stamp in hand and have a good reputation. And claiming a new perforation rate (the way this thread evolved) is an extraordinary claim, and extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. If folks are going to call out the VG I hope they can back it up with firm evidence (like multiple examples, other expert certifications, etc.).

My concern is this... this thread started off as 'check out this unusual stamp' and quickly lead to the existence of a previously undescribed SQ perforation (along with a number of other similar threads). This cert is a significant impact to the research. Are there other reperf stamps included in the discovery and research that have lead to claims of previously undocumented and new perfs being described? Before making public claims of new perforation should not independent certification be made before including them in any census that describes them as new and going public?

Obviously asking other collectors is a good way to gather information and this venue can help in that way. But we have to be careful to define them as preliminary inquiries, we have thousands of other folks reading these threads and they can easily take away incorrect info. If someone had read this thread before yesterday and has not revisited, they would be walking around thinking that a new perf exists. But right now that is questionable and it is obvious that at a minimum more discovery and research needs to be done.
Don
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Posted 12/22/2020   12:23 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add jogil to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
51studebaker: 12.5 (x 12.5) perforations do already exist on Canada Scott 37d but it is a scarce stamp from 1870. Thus, believing another potential possibility but as a compound perforation was interesting. The experts closely looked at the stamp and found that its printing, paper and vertical perfs were from the 1890s as they state and have numbered it as Scott 41. 12.5 or 12 perfs on SQ stamps are not new but the 12.5 x 12 compound perforations on a SQ stamp appeared to be new. The Rosback Pony rotary perforator from 1915 was not used to perforate SQ Scott 37d from 1870 since it didn't exist back then. I mention it since it is the most likely possibility to use for faking 12.5 gauge stamps since they are still around. This Rosback perforator was used to perforate (12.5) U.S. Scott # 536 (1919).
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Edited by jogil - 12/22/2020 12:52 pm
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