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Opening Folded Envelopes . Or Not?

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Posted 06/02/2021   11:25 am  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add STTScott to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
I'fe recently been interested in late 1800s/early 1900s folded envelopes with various states of postage. I'm of the mind not to open those envelopes, but jeez o pete -- I really have to hold myself back from doing that because I'm too curious, but I don't want to ruin things by opening it.

Anyone else run into this? Or are these items only "worth" the stamp and the cover?
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Edited by STTScott - 06/02/2021 11:28 am

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Posted 06/02/2021   11:36 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add classic_paper to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
By "folded envelopes" do you mean sealed? As in, sent through the mail but never opened and read by the recipient?

If so, either way. From a philatelic perspective, I'm not sure the contents matter to the value, for or against. But you of course risk damage to the cover by opening it.
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Posted 06/02/2021   11:56 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add John Becker to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
STTScott,
Your question to too vague. Please illustrate several examples, because the contents can vary from garbage to treasure.
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Posted 06/02/2021   12:00 pm  Show Profile Check GeoffHa's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add GeoffHa to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Assuming that you mean an "envelope" created by the sender's folding the paper into a rectangular shape, rather than a tailor-made, there's ordinarily no reason not to open them for display purposes. But is that what you mean?
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Posted 06/02/2021   12:52 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add PMStamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Are you referring to Aerogrammes?
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Posted 06/02/2021   1:27 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add bookbndrbob to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Please post an image.

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Posted 06/02/2021   9:25 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Parcelpostguy to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
1800s/early 1900s


Quote:
Are you referring to Aerogrammes?


I can safely answer, "No" to the 19th Century and, "No" again for any material prior to December 17, 1903 in the 1900s. Then again I could be missing something; to quote Wilbur, "right bro?"





1800s, not aerogram and note word, "envelope" printed on it:



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Edited by Parcelpostguy - 06/03/2021 12:49 am
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Posted 06/03/2021   12:20 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add classic_paper to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I can safely answer, "No" to the 18th Century and, "No" again for any material prior to December 17, 1903 in the 1900s. Then again I could be missing something; to quote Wilbur, "right bro?"


No one said 18th century, "1800s" is the 19th century. In fact, this looks like Sc U293, from 1886. So, you may have missed something.
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Posted 06/03/2021   12:29 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add DrewM to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
"Envelope" means "folded around something" like the world "envelop," so all envelopes are folded. Normally in collections regular envelopes are not cut open for display, but that doesn't mean you can't do that. In stamp shows, for example, I've seen them opened up completely in order to show markings on both the back and front. It may lower the value of the cover to do this as most collectors will prefer an intact envelope. Is this what you're asking?
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Posted 06/03/2021   12:53 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Parcelpostguy to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
No one said 18th


Thanks, your correct and its fixed. Once we made it to the 21st Century, I ran out of fingers and toes which really throws off my math.

@DrewM, did you look at and read the Grant Letter Sheet image I posted above which is labeled "ENVELOPE." (yes with period too)? Additional contents not allowed, just as with the later aerograms.

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Edited by Parcelpostguy - 06/03/2021 12:58 am
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Posted 06/03/2021   02:37 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add STTScott to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
To clarify: By envelope, I meant folded around the correspondence and sent thru the USPS, not a commercially-made lick and stick envelope.. This was a recent purchase that I haven't received yet to know what (if anything) is inside. But certainly, something was or is inside.

I was drawn to it because it was sent at a time when an actual postage stamp was not available for some reason or another, and the purchase price was really nice.


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Edited by STTScott - 06/03/2021 02:44 am
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Posted 06/03/2021   02:50 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add STTScott to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
@classicpaper said >> But you of course risk damage to the cover by opening it. <<

Yup, that's what I was referring in my original post. Basically, it was/is a choice of let it be, or if I open/unfold it, will that matter in terms of the original integrity of the cover and the backside, at least in terms of what cover collectors consider important?

As I mentioned, I haven't received this purchase yet, so I don't know how it was sealed, so the answer to that will matter when I do receive it. I'm still pretty hinky about this very thing and messing with things that probably shouldn't he messed with.
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Edited by STTScott - 06/03/2021 02:59 am
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Posted 06/03/2021   08:28 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add hoosierboy to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Good morning, STTScott,

What you have is a stampless cover. Prior to 1845 postage was charged by the sheets of paper used and a letter could be sent collect to its addressee. If the sender prepaid the postage it would have been marked paid.

In this earliest pre stamp era of postal history mostly before July 1, 1845 with some later into the 1850's the content of these letters can be more valuable and interesting than the outside of the cover. Carefully unfolding this item to see its contents is usually no problem.
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Edited by hoosierboy - 06/03/2021 08:30 am
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Posted 06/03/2021   09:07 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add STTScott to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
@hoosierboy: Thanks for the reply. The seller says the postmark is 1851, even tho that's not easy to see from the envelope.

The original letter is obviously still contained, and really, that piques my interest even more than the cover, which is really neat and a fine addition, but I've always been interested in the day to day lives of people in days of yore and being able to read about it from their own hand.

Y'all here have given fodder for thought, and I appreciate that.
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Edited by STTScott - 06/03/2021 09:11 am
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Posted 06/03/2021   09:09 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add wkusau to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
STTScott, Your Stampless cover, actually may be a folded letter, falls into the Postal History part of the the hobby. The Postal Historians are interested in the postal markings and routes but then it opens up to the senders and receivers, physical contents, and written contents. These historians are looking for historically important people, places, and things. These are the people that originally said "leave stamps on the postcards and covers".
So your item was originally sealed with wax. The round deformed area near the seam on the back. I expect that the wax has already been broken and the letter can be opened, carefully. You should be able to open it to read it but be careful. Just open it enough to read and photograph the contents. Do not try to flatten it.
I usually transcribe the letters like this and photograph them once opened. Use the photo and transcription in any display. Then refold them and put them away.

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Posted 06/03/2021   09:14 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add John Becker to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Now that we have an example, answers can be more specific than just guesses and speculation.

Short answer: gently open it up and enjoy reading it.

Longer answer: The paper of this letter is quite sturdy. It is not the cheaper and more fragile wood-pulp of the late 1800s. In fact the two vertical lines running through the postmark and the rate indicate your cover was previously refolded by the recipient for filing purposes (and when the upside down docketing was added above the address), and then re-re-folded to its original mailing configuration later, likely when it entered the philatelic market.

Due to the distance/rate, yours is also sent after July 1, 1845. Paid vs collect is still an option at this time, as I noted in another thread about this same cover. The sender may have had stamps on-hand, but chose to send this letter collect, because it is not explicitly marked "paid" next to the rate.

These letters were typically folded at a slight angle in such a way that the smaller bottom tucked into the larger top and then sealed with a small drop sealing wax or wafer-seal. It won't be resealed. Unfold and enjoy it.
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