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Identification Help Please - Cannot Find History Of Stamp Anywhere

 
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New Member

United States
4 Posts
Posted 12/08/2021   3:58 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add luckycollector to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
I recently acquired an old "United States Navy Bill" from 1871. Attached to this historic document is a "Foreign Bill" Victoria stamp for One Pound Ten Schillings. According to my research, there was no stamp with this high of value produced until the early 1880's. I'm hoping this community can help me unravel the mystery of this stamp.

Due to the document the stamp is affixed to, I have no concerns about the stamp's authenticity.

Any ideas as to the value of the stamp would also be a big help.

Your assistance is greatly appreciated!
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Pillar Of The Community
United Kingdom
6127 Posts
Posted 12/08/2021   4:07 pm  Show Profile Check GeoffHa's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add GeoffHa to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
GB fiscal stamp, not a postage stamp.

Lots more here

https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_...p&_sacat=260
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Edited by GeoffHa - 12/08/2021 4:08 pm
Pillar Of The Community
France, Metropolitan
3261 Posts
Posted 12/08/2021   4:28 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add perf12 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Does not look like it is tied to the document?
You can check the cat.
https://www.rpsl.org.uk/gplstatic/B...atalogue.pdf


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Pillar Of The Community
United States
7771 Posts
Posted 12/08/2021   4:33 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Petert4522 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Luckycollector, welcome to the community. Nice looking stamp! If the stamp is tied to the document we can only answer your question if you post a scan of the document.


Peter
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New Member
United States
4 Posts
Posted 12/08/2021   4:44 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add luckycollector to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thank you for the catalog link. I have actually reviewed the same catalog and cannot find anything related to this stamp. The stamp itself is ink stamped "1871" and the document it's attached to is dated April 21, 1871 and also June 10th 1871. The stamp is definitely attached to the document. I tried to upload an image of the document but the size is too large. I'll try again...

The document is related to 6,000 pounds sterling, which the Navy appears to have delivered to Shanghai, hence why I believe such a large valued stamp was used. However, I cannot find any other stamp like this in existence.

I'm very grateful for the help.
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Australia
34194 Posts
Posted 12/08/2021   4:47 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Great Britain
Foreign Bill
1871
Barefoot #86 1 Pound,ten shillings. Green
Typo
De la Rue Wmk VR
Paper Surfaced Perf 14
CV: 3 1989

Foreign Bills were essentially bank drafts for transfers of money to a foreign country.

Bib: Great Britain Revenues
J. Barefoot
European Philately 1
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Edited by rod222 - 12/08/2021 4:56 pm
Valued Member
Finland
145 Posts
Posted 12/08/2021   4:57 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add kuikka to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Tied to document = cancelation continues from the stamp to the document.
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Australia
34194 Posts
Posted 12/08/2021   5:03 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

You may wish to change your thread title
to something like "Great Britain Revenue Foreign Bill" or similar.

It assists or future searches for a knowledge base.
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New Member
United States
4 Posts
Posted 12/08/2021   5:12 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add luckycollector to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thank you for the help! I tried looking up 1871 Barefoot #86 and I cannot find anything related to this stamp. I apologize for my ignorance on stamps and best practices for the forum (i.e. title). I primarily collect coins and historical documents, so the stamp element is new to me.

I just double checked my facts and Wikipedia shows the 10 shilling and 1 pound values were not introduced until 1878. If that's the case, how could this stamp be in existence in 1871?

Thanks!
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Australia
34194 Posts
Posted 12/08/2021   5:19 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
LC
I think we are missing the point.
Apologies, I should have been more explicit
This is a "REVENUE STAMP" not postage.

The stamp does not carry the mail, it indicates payment of an impost.

Revenue stamps afford a differing catalogue series.
Hope that solves your query.


Quote:
Bib: Great Britain Revenues
J. Barefoot
European Philately 1


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Edited by rod222 - 12/08/2021 5:25 pm
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Australia
34194 Posts
Posted 12/08/2021   5:30 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Revenue taxation, we can thank the Dutch for that enterprise.
William and Mary introduced it in 1694
about the same time of other Dutch innovations, Tulips and Coffee houses.

JBFT

Embossed taxation dies exist for 1d to 50,000
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Edited by rod222 - 12/08/2021 5:32 pm
Pillar Of The Community
Netherlands
1265 Posts
Posted 12/08/2021   5:33 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add NSK to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
`Postage stamps paid for the carriage of mail items, including parcels. Revenue stamps were proof of payment of taxes. Your stamp is the latter. Postage stamps with a value of 10 shillings or one pound were first issued in 1878. From 1881, postage and some revenue stamps could be used both for prepayment of carriage of mail and for payment of certain taxes. Later, stamps were issued to this purpose with the inscription "postage and revenue."

There never was a postage stamp of one pound ten shilings. Yours was only issued as proof of payment of tax.


Quote:
about the same time of other Dutch innovations, Tulips and Coffee houses.


And, recently, coffee shops where you do not drink coffee.
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Edited by NSK - 12/08/2021 5:34 pm
Pillar Of The Community
United Kingdom
6127 Posts
Posted 12/08/2021   5:43 pm  Show Profile Check GeoffHa's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add GeoffHa to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Weren't tulips an Ottoman innovation?
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Pillar Of The Community
Netherlands
1265 Posts
Posted 12/08/2021   5:51 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add NSK to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Nope, Persian.

I think rod was being British and thanking us for introducing such pleasure to Blighty.
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Edited by NSK - 12/08/2021 5:51 pm
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Australia
34194 Posts
Posted 12/08/2021   6:37 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The best pleasure is the Language.
When I was single, I could sit and listen to young Dutch ladies
talk, and fall in love. I found it intoxicating.

Anyhow back to Tulips, I think Barefoot, whom I was paraphrasing
was speaking about "Tulip Mania" (The 17th century bitcoin)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tulip_mania

I was not aware of the Ottoman history, so thanks for that.
wiki suggests Chinese origin, and cultivated by the Ottomans.

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Edited by rod222 - 12/08/2021 6:46 pm
New Member
United States
4 Posts
Posted 12/08/2021   9:55 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add luckycollector to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks everyone! Y'all Rock!!!!
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