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I Hope I Am In The Right Place - Is This Some Sort Of First Day Cover?

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Posted 12/27/2021   09:06 am  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add jchrisler to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
I have a very large postcard, it measures 9" x 5 1/2" which has me rather confused. It looks like some sort of special cover to me, not sure if it is a first day cover or some other special kind of cover. It was mailed from Atlantic City, N.J. to San Francisco, CA. Since I don't know much else about this other than A.P.S. is the acronym for the American Philatelic Society.

I am still working on getting another copy of the Scott catalog, since I haven't got one yet I would appreciate if someone could identify the stamp that was used on this cover. Thank you in advance for the identification.

Here is the post card, and I will note that the reverse side of the card is totally blank:


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Posted 12/27/2021   09:23 am  Show Profile Check GeoffHa's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add GeoffHa to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
It's the lower left corner of the miniature sheet issued to accompany the exhibition, and the postmark is of the first day of issue with a special convention postmark.
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Posted 12/27/2021   09:39 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add jchrisler to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thankyou GeoffHa for telling me what it is. Rather than being a miniature it is oversized - so that is confusing to me, why so big? I read the thread below in this section of the forum about what a first cover and a first issue are, so I am going to have to go back and read it again because I am confused about what a first cover is versus a first issue. Whew! Some of this stuff is hard... Thank you again, Julie
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Posted 12/27/2021   09:44 am  Show Profile Check GeoffHa's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add GeoffHa to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Julie - it's oversized because it's cut from a larger sheet of several stamps - here's an example.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/324102801309
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Posted 12/27/2021   10:40 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add John Becker to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Julie,
You may be overthinking this.
Yes, you have a "First Day of Issue" cover (well, a card) for Scott 750 issued on August 28, 1934.
As GeoffHa noted, it is 1/6 of the souvenir sheet of 6 stamps.
This is 3 years before they started putting the "First Day of Issue" wording in the killer bars, which may be what is confusing you.
FDCs appear on all sorts and sizes of cards, covers, and miscellaneous objects ... in this case an oversized card large enough to be used with the entire souvenir sheet of 6, but looking a bit bare with only 1 stamp on it.
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Edited by John Becker - 12/27/2021 10:42 am
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Posted 12/27/2021   11:29 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add jchrisler to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Now I understand, thank you to both of you, GeoffHa and JohnBecker. I did go down and re-read the difference between a first issue (which I now understand the US Post Office began recognizing in 1937) and a first cover. Your example was very helpful Geoff, and you explained it in a way that I could understand John. Thankyou, both of you. Julie
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Posted 12/27/2021   11:55 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add John Becker to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Julie,
I don't think you quite understand it yet as "first issue" and "first cover" are not really phrases in the stamp collecting vocabulary. Rather there are "first day of issue" and "first day cover".
This recent thread may be helpful with "first" terminology:
http://goscf.com/t/79488
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Edited by John Becker - 12/27/2021 11:58 am
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Posted 12/27/2021   6:24 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add jchrisler to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thank you for pointing me back to that thread, I have read it 5 or 6 times now truly think I understand. ""First day of issue" would be the first day a stamp is issued and goes through the mail with a postal stamp indicating such, while the "first day cover" would not be coming from the same post office as the "first day of issue", it would be postmarked in another post office maybe on the "first day of issue", maybe not. This is how it is sorted out for me, I hope I have it correct this time. Thanks John, Julie
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Posted 12/27/2021   6:46 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add classic_paper to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
You're making it too complicated. The phrases are complimentary, not comparative or mutually exclusive.

A first day cover (FDC) is a postal card or stamped envelope that uses a stamp that is canceled on the first day the stamp is authorized for use within the country or territory of the stamp-issuing authority.

The first day a stamp can be legally used is the "first day of issue." If someone uses it on that very first day, the postcard or envelope on which they affixed that stamp is a "first day cover."

That's it. There's nothing more to it.
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Posted 12/27/2021   7:11 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi Julie,
Let's get complicated, (But for fun )

Here is a list of acronyms and terms across Philately
Take from it, what you will, Philately can be as broad as you wish,
or as specialised as you want to make it.

"Have fun" (Arthur Mongan)

All excerpts from "Askphil"



AFDCS: American First Day Cover Society.

Alternate cancel: any First Day cancellation from the official First Day city, other than the official First Day USPS
postmarks.

Cachet:
1: a rubber stamp or printed impression on an envelope which describes the event for which the envelope was mailed; cachets are used for first days of issue, first flights, naval events, stamp exhibitions, etc.

2: rubber stamp or seal, not postal.

3: small marks made by dealers, experts on backs of stamps as marks of authenticity or identification.

4: can be privately applied or officially applied by a post office; also known as "Signum."


Cancel, Official: official USPS postmark at First Day of Issue site.

Esoterica:
any item, besides a cover, postcard or envelope, that has been cancelled on the First Day and doesn't fit any of
the regular collecting categories

F D C: see First Day Cover. F D I: see First Day of Issue.

First day: the day on which a stamp is first officially sold by the Post Office.

First day ceremony program: special items created for distribution to guests at first-day ceremonies

First day cover: a newly issued stamp affixed to an envelope and postmarked on the first day of sale at a city designated by the Postal Service.


First Day Objects (FDO): various non-philatelic objects to which a stamp and first day cancel was applied.

First day of issue (FDOI): the day on which a stamp is initially placed on sale by postal authorities.

First day of issue office: a post office authorized to sell a new postage item on the first day of sale.

First day of rate: postmark denoting the first day of usage of a new postal rate.

New issue poster: Post Office Department poster, started in 1959, where collector affixed new issue stamps to the poster and had them canceled on first day of issue.

Paraphilatelic: post office announcements of a new stamp, first day of issue ceremony programs, souvenir pages, etc.

Philadelpia: misspelling of Philadelphia on cancellation of first day cover for "Honoring the Teachers of America" issue, July 1, 1957.

Philography: term for autographed first day covers.


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Posted 12/28/2021   12:14 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add jchrisler to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Well, I do believe I finally understand what a First Day Cover is, and I believe I finally understand what a First Day of Issue is. It has all accumulated in my brain, and I finally think I've got it. Truly I believe I've got it!
And thank you rod222 for the list of philatelic terms, I did enjoy it after reading it over about 5 or 6 times. And thank you classic_paper for your input, it helped me immensely. Thank you for everyone that has contributed to this thread for your input, it has all helped me understand which I do appreciate. Julie
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Posted 02/15/2022   12:06 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Basecamp1 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Great info for old cover collector with little specific knowledge on the particulars of the cover collecting hobby. With so many millions of covers issued, is there any hope of the market improving for those of us that have a great deal of covers? Please note that I am a new member and that I am not eligible to buy or sell. This is just a question for those more experienced than me, and is in no way a solicitation for a sale or buy. I made an error earlier and asked a member about an item he had for sale and received a rather ominous warning to "correct my error". No offense to anyone, but this seems a bit strange to receive something like this on such a good, friendly site as this. If an experienced member could explain this type of warning, I would really appreciate it. I would like to remain a member and use the site as it has afforded me much valuable information. But don't need the stamp police in my life.
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Posted 02/15/2022   12:46 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add oldboldandbrash to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
A good cover is a good cover and a dollar cover is a dollar cover. I know it when I see it (for the most part). What goes into a good cover is its postal history, the stamps used, the condition, the market's desire for that kind of cover and whatnot. It used to be that everyone was hot and bothered for nazi propaganda cards, now not so much. Tastes change and you just have to acquire the right stuff before it gets valuable, or simply acquire it from someone who has no idea what they have. Such is life
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Posted 02/15/2022   08:34 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Noocassel to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I immediately saw the stamp as a Farleys folly, an imperforate stamp made originally by US post master Mr Farley as gifts for stamp collectors in the government. a court case meant that more imperforate stamps had to be made and put on sale to the public. What you have is one of the stamps produced for sale to the public. I don't collect US stamps so I might be wrong in details but that is the general story of the stamp, sorry I don't know its Scott number.
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Posted 02/15/2022   10:30 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add bobby131313 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
This is just a question for those more experienced than me, and is in no way a solicitation for a sale or buy. I made an error earlier and asked a member about an item he had for sale and received a rather ominous warning to "correct my error". No offense to anyone, but this seems a bit strange to receive something like this on such a good, friendly site as this. If an experienced member could explain this type of warning, I would really appreciate it. I would like to remain a member and use the site as it has afforded me much valuable information. But don't need the stamp police in my life.


We have rules on buying/selling/trading. You agreed to them when you registered. When you got the "ominous warning," it even gave you a link to the rules. If you consider rules "policing," and you don't like it then maybe this site isn't for you. Would rather have you stay though.
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Posted 02/15/2022   2:09 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add jleb1979 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Great info for old cover collector with little specific knowledge on the particulars of the cover collecting hobby. With so many millions of covers issued, is there any hope of the market improving for those of us that have a great deal of covers? Please note that I am a new member and that I am not eligible to buy or sell. This is just a question for those more experienced than me, and is in no way a solicitation for a sale or buy.


Wish I could offer some encouragement on the market worth of modern US first day covers, but I'm afraid I cannot, Basecamp.

You said it yourself - they are out there in the millions. They must be a minor profit center for the USPS, which gives itself a window of 60 days (!) to affix the cancellation, so basically, they have been pretty much manufactured "collectibles" for decades at this point.

To be honest, I expect that with the demographics being what they are, a lot more modern FDC collections will come onto the market in the next decade or two and they'll be worth even less. it's just supply and demand I'm afraid.

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