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A Weak Strike Of A NY Town And A Suggestion

 
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Valued Member
United States
40 Posts
Posted 02/04/2022   09:35 am  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add Rephil to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
I'm not a cover specialist but have accumulated some covers over the years and really enjoy this aspect of philately. I have noticed, however, that one thing that appears to be common in cover collecting is the mystery cover or enclosure. There are cancels that seem "fancy" but you can't find them in any of your references. There are poor strikes of a CDS and you'd like to know what it is. There are enclosures written in a 19th century hand and you can't quite read an interesting part. Other examples abound.
I would like to suggest that an ongoing thread be established in this particular forum that might be called the "Detectives Corner." For each of the examples I've noted above, there always seems to be someone who has a knack for reading a cancel or has considerable experience with old handwriting or knows the cancels of a particular state or region or type who can help with or solve the mystery. Other experts might better understand daily life in some earlier period or the way people expressed themselves. Time changes our language. Just consider how mysterious our everyday communication about "cells" and "microwaves" would be to a 19th century American.
To kick things off I'll submit this weak strike of a New York CDS that has me puzzled. I've tried to use various filters and lightings but the attached is the best I can do. It appears to have 13 characters but I can't find a NY town or village that seems to fit with it.
Suggestions about this cancel or about the idea of a Detectives Corner would be welcomed.


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Pillar Of The Community
5148 Posts
Posted 02/04/2022   10:11 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add John Becker to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
A fine suggestion. May I add the following guidance:
1. Posting a scan of the entire mail piece including the back side if there is anything there. Most 1800s mail did not travel very far, such that the origin town is more likely to be near the destination town than otherwise.
2. Posting a close-up scan of the postmark.
3. Posting any scans with special lighting/contrast or digitally altered scans to emphasize the mark, such as images processed through Retroveal.

Two additional notes:
1. Jim Forte's website has a list of post offices including search capabilities by partial letter strings at:
https://www.postalhistory.com/Post_...es/index.htm
2. Not every cancel is "fancy". Not every cancel is listed in the various fancy cancel books They are a small representative sampling of what the author had available to them.

All that said, your cancel looks like Williamsburgh.
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Pillar Of The Community
United States
605 Posts
Posted 02/04/2022   10:19 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Linus to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
John beat me to it, but used Jim Forte to find this:

Linus


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Valued Member
United States
102 Posts
Posted 02/04/2022   10:22 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add pbmorris to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
My guess is Williamsburgh NY 1906 time frame.

https://www.rumseyauctions.com/auct...hapter/44/69
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Valued Member
United States
102 Posts
Posted 02/04/2022   10:24 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add pbmorris to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Boy am I slow.
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Pillar Of The Community
5148 Posts
Posted 02/04/2022   10:50 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add John Becker to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The link to the Rumsey site refers to an 1863 cover, rather than 1906.

1893-1895 is another time period to keep in mind as a transition point. Postmaster John Wanamaker oversaw a simplification and standardization of town names. Post office listings will show many discontinued post office listings (DPOs) in this era, which are nothing more than name changes. For example
burgh became burg
borough became boro
centre became center
apostrophes were dropped
2-word towns become one either by running the words together or dropping a word altogether like those ending with Mills, Furnace, Station, etc.
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United States
102 Posts
Posted 02/04/2022   11:55 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add pbmorris to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Who knows what I was looking at.
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Valued Member
United States
40 Posts
Posted 02/07/2022   12:38 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Rephil to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks to all who replied.

Yes, the town is Williamsburg(h)--subsequently just part of Brooklyn-- and if I had thought about about the possibioity of a dropped letter--as per John's suggestion--I would have nailed it myself.

Also, following up on John's comment, the use of "fancy" to characterize anything that is not a simple CDS is rife, particularly on EBay. To find a real fancy cancel there, one must wade through a mound of duplexes, simple cork killers that are just smudges, and wavy line machine cancels.
But as we know, complaing to EBay about misdescriptions is pretty hopeless.
I wish the Stamp Community could establish a committee empowered to hand out letters of censure to offending dealers to be added to their feedback but I'm sure that idea would be squashed by EBay. They just care that money keeps flowing and don't want to be involved in a "truth in advertising" campaign.
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Pillar Of The Community
5148 Posts
Posted 02/07/2022   12:51 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add John Becker to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
But as we know, complaining to eBay about misdescriptions is pretty hopeless

That would be wasted time. Consider the number of FDCs listed as postal history. Matchbooks listed as postcards, etc. Listings are made by humans with all levels of knowledge of what they have and how to describe it. There will never be standardization at the highest level, let alone in the details. Moving on ....

A story I have told before ... I once sold a silver medal for my dad. He mentioned it was "tarnished". I countered that it had "patina". He asked the difference. I said that if I were trying to BUY it, it was tarnished. If I were trying to SELL it, it had patina. All the cancels I am selling are thus fancy! Yes, there is a mountain of "fancy" puffery to wade through on ebay. Sometimes a blob is just a blob and nothing more.
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Valued Member
United States
73 Posts
Posted 02/19/2022   10:03 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add mljespe to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Rephil ... I like the idea of "Detectives Corner."

Also Ebay volume and ebay listings can work to advantage at times also. Knowledge is power...it is also like treasure hunting thru possibilities due to the shear volume and wrong spellings ... can be fun and sometimes frustrating.

Good thread!
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