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Want Your Opinion 10A Or 11A On Cover Is It A 100j? What Would You Do With It

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Posted 05/18/2022   7:06 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rgstamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
In my crazy system of grading, any used stamp with a cancel across the face should get 2 to 5 points deducted. I'm entitled to my own opinion. Perfect (100) does not only mean "margin perfect".

But no one cares about my personal system. Everyone cares about an arbitrary system (PSE) based mainly on margins created 20 plus years ago by another guy.

The stamp you posted on cover is actually amazing. Most 100J or 98J imperforate stamps of this era are manufactured. Multiples are cut up with precision to create perfect jumbo margins. The fact that this stamp was cut to such perfection for real usage in the 1800s is truly remarkable. If you remove the stamp from cover, no one will ever actually believe the stamp was not "manufactured"
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Posted 05/18/2022   7:30 pm  Show Profile Check eyeonwall's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add eyeonwall to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The cover in this case is unattractive with the stains (and the doodling doesn't help).
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Posted 05/18/2022   8:32 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Caper123 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
rgstamp - you hit the nail on the head. The quality of the stamp will not be improved one iota by its removal from the cover, so why remove it? The authenticity of the beautiful state of the stamp would be lost, and as you said, it will be considered 'manufactured' by many for evermore if removed
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Posted 05/18/2022   9:31 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add classic_paper to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
The stamps aren't "glued" back on, that would be ridiculous!

It's ridiculous? The stamp got glued on the cover the first time, wasn't it? Our hobby calls it gum, but it's just an adhesive, or more plainly… glue.


Quote:
by using the original gum on the stamp

Since you have to use a solvent (that includes water) to separate the stamp from the cover, one couldn't possibly use the original gum. Unless by that you mean a modern recreation of the contemporary gum formula?
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Edited by classic_paper - 05/18/2022 9:38 pm
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Posted 05/18/2022   10:17 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rogdcam to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I vote for removing the stamp from cover and grading it.
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Posted 05/18/2022   10:45 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Willwood42 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I don't believe what rodgcam just wrote
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Posted 05/19/2022   11:11 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add jgoody2shoes to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
classic_paper, have you ever soaked a stamp off, (using room temperature water, not any type of solvent) place the stamp on blotter paper or paper towel or a drying book only to find it adhered to that paper after drying and have to resoak it? 'nough said!

One other thing, as the cover on the whole is far from beautiful, I have also thought of cutting off the corner encapsulating the postmark and making a nice on-piece addition to my stamp album. What do you think of that? Again, sorry to have stirred-the-pot a bit and collecting such "fury" amongst the group! Just was simply looking for other "nice" opinions.

""Today I made and appearance downtown
I am an expert witness, because I say I am
And I said, 'Gentleman....and I use that word loosely...I will testify for you
I'm a gun for hire, I'm a saint, I'm a liar
Because there are no facts, there is no truth, just data to be manipulated
I can get you any result you like....what's it worth to ya?
Because there is no wrong, there is no right
And I sleep very well at night
No shame, no solution
No remorse, no retribution
Just people selling t-shirts
Just opportunity to participate in this pathetic little circus
And winning, winning, winning"

Excerpt from "The Garden of Allah" (Don Henley)
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Edited by jgoody2shoes - 05/19/2022 11:29 am
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Posted 05/19/2022   11:20 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add jgoody2shoes to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
rgstamp, Your last paragraph was my own opinion that I kept to myself to see if anyone else said it without my coercion. That being said, is why I was asking about getting certs for both on and off cover. I too was in total disbelief that someone actually cut this stamp so absolutely perfect and to find it on cover was like finding the Holy Grail of this stamp! Thank you for giving me affirmation on my thoughts. Thanks to all of you. I am not upset in the least, but I find it so interesting how different but obviously seasoned and diverse of a field of philatelists! Again, thanks to all of you, it has been fun so far!
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Posted 05/19/2022   2:02 pm  Show Profile Check rlsny's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add rlsny to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
If the goal is to maximize the value for sale I'm with Rogdcam. Take it off and grade it.
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Posted 05/19/2022   2:55 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add txstamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I agree that soaking and re-affixing the stamp is easily done - for those who know what they are doing -- not for beginners.

Another alternative if you soaked/removed it would be to hinge it back in place on the cover. That is also often done.

I agree with previous comments that its a nice stamp to see genuinely used as such.
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Posted 05/19/2022   10:40 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add canyoneer to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
It seems that removing then reattaching (using the original gum) is similar to re-brushing/re-distributing gum on a hinged stamp to make it look nh or vlh. It falls in the "altered" category.

Also IMO, a #11 100J stamp that was created in 1851 and legitimately used on cover vs. 100J trimmed from a multiple of #11's in modern times are two very different things. Really not sure why PSE couldn't grade it while leaving it on the cover.

Probably a good question for a few of the major auction firms.
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Posted 05/20/2022   12:16 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rogdcam to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Really not sure why PSE couldn't grade it while leaving it on the cover.


Because they could assign a grade, somebody could remove the stamp, damaging it in the process and the grade would no longer be valid. Best to just do the right thing and remove the stamp which will also preserve the stamp.

All of the hand wringing is always amusing since every used stamp we collect came from a piece of mail. Where are the tears for those instances of philatelic mayhem?
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Posted 05/20/2022   12:22 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add stanshepp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I*** Edited by Staff - Please review the rules that you agreed to when you registered. ***
***Sorry, jgoody2shoes is a new member and does not have enough posts to buy/sell/trade yet***
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Posted 05/20/2022   7:57 pm  Show Profile Check eyeonwall's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add eyeonwall to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
"It seems that removing then reattaching (using the original gum) is similar to re-brushing/re-distributing gum on a hinged stamp to make it look nh or vlh. It falls in the "altered" category."

If it is hinged back in place, then no one should be deceived, but if it is glued back in place, then you have a point.
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Posted 05/20/2022   8:02 pm  Show Profile Check eyeonwall's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add eyeonwall to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
"Because they could assign a grade, somebody could remove the stamp, damaging it in the process and the grade would no longer be valid. "

And how is that different than an off cover stamp that is certed and subsequently damaged? Everyone should know that the condition aspect of a cert only applies to the moment it is certed.
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