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Counterfeit Stamps Pass Postal Scrutiny

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Posted 06/19/2022   8:17 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add serf_tide to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
I've purchased forever sheets from several resellers that are not tagged. Initially, I was not aware of how extensive this was. One seller signaled me that the "frozen treat" booklets needed a check and I ordered a short wave UV lamp and sure enough, they were not tagged. I know that there are other posts out here about it. Two sellers have argued extensively that these must be legit because they've sent many things through the post office using them. My wife had this same question. When we realized that I had purchased all of these untagged forever booklets and sheets, she had already used a couple dozen on every day mailings. My question is simple...this is passing through the USPS system. Why are they allowing it?
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Posted 06/19/2022   8:41 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rogdcam to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
They are passing through the system. They are not necessarily "allowing" it. If you knowingly use these fake stamps to mail items, you are a part of the problem. Most if not all of these counterfeits are coming from China, and it is overwhelming the USPS. China is also killing us with Fentanyl and the chemicals to produce Fentanyl and nothing is really done about it directly with China. Of course, our Southern border is wide open so what would one expect. The stamps no doubt are shipped via air cargo but who knows where they fall on the priority list if there even is a priority list anymore.
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Posted 06/19/2022   9:08 pm  Show Profile Check 51studebaker's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add 51studebaker to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I agree. Whether or not a stamp passes through the postal service means little to nothing. Many USPS non-tagged stamps are still legitimate to use, the automated equipment is not examining the stamp design to see if it is legitimate. As far as I know, it uses the tagging for orientation purposes.
Don
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Posted 06/19/2022   9:42 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add revcollector to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply




Quote:
Of course, our Southern border is wide open so what would one expect.

Totally false. But what would one expect.

https://www.politifact.com/factchec...pen-s-false/
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Posted 06/19/2022   11:09 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Parcelpostguy to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
...stamps no doubt are shipped via air cargo....


Usually the counterfeits are floated to the USA in shipping cargo containers. Postal Inspectors and US Customs find them that way, not via air.



Edit:
Invalid stamps being missed and allowed to carry the mail is not a new matter:



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Edited by Parcelpostguy - 06/19/2022 11:49 pm
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Posted 06/19/2022   11:43 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Parcelpostguy to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Totally false.


Absolute statements, e.g. totally or wide open, are problematic especially in political debates on a stamp forum.

Your statement is, at best, disingenuous as the border is not closed nor does it have totally enforced restricted entry. The border is thus open, and how open it is is a subjective term. I believe it is only a little open just like the girl, or if he prefers, boy, down the street is just a little pregnant.

That said, the border conditions are rapidly changing such that a link to an article from November 2021 when there have occurred over a million encounters along the southern border since then plus an untold and uncounted number of crossing for with the was no "encounter" thus thwarting a count. Of course during the same period the Executive Branch has changed the rules several times while the Judicial Branch alters those change attempts in the ongoing question of what are the rules, which rules need to be followed, when, by whom and under what circumstances.
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Posted 06/20/2022   12:25 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rogdcam to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Totally false. But what would one expect.


This type of comment no longer surprises me.
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Posted 06/20/2022   06:43 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add revcollector to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
This is an official Chinese government operation, not some fly by night hand to mouth business. They will have a series of well established routes set up; no one can possibly catch close to everything. Since political destabilization and not profit is the motive, they can afford to have many different methods of transportation by air or sea. I doubt that the southern border has a whole lot to do with it, since they have so many options without it.
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Posted 06/20/2022   11:08 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rogdcam to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
For quite a while the fake Forever stamps sold on eBay were coming from China directly via USPS using a City of Industry CA address and taking advantage of the special cheap packet rates we gave to China. Not exactly James Bond stuff.
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Posted 06/20/2022   12:01 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add gvol21 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
As I occasionally purchase used stamps on Facebook Marketplace, the ad algorithms now target me for lots of these (presumably counterfeit) Forever stamps, and I'll occasionally report the ad to Facebook; there's a 'Appears to be Counterfeit' option. Not sure that flagging it for their review does anything, but it feels good.

The borders are both more and less open than some here would claim. Always have been porous, always will be. The real question is the magnitude of the problem: is the amount of lost revenue to the counterfeiters greater than the expenditure required to track them down?


Quote:
This is an official Chinese government operation, not some fly by night hand to mouth business. They will have a series of well established routes set up; no one can possibly catch close to everything. Since political destabilization and not profit is the motive, they can afford to have many different methods of transportation by air or sea.

I'd be curious to know what your sources are. My guess has always been that Occam's razor applies here: sure, there could be a cloak-and-dagger conspiracy going on, but the more likely option is that profit is indeed the motive, and that a bunch of counterfeiters have realized that selling stamps for half of face when the costs are a fraction of that is a lucrative business.
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Posted 06/20/2022   3:23 pm  Show Profile Check wheelman's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add wheelman to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
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Posted 06/20/2022   4:27 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add alub to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I collect used US. So friends and coworkers save stamps they get in the mail for me. The nicest goes in my collection, the rest in stock-books, organized by year. I have probably a few hundred duplicate stamps from the last 10 years.

I took a black-light to it the duplicates to see what I'd find. I found over a dozen forgeries.

Upon closer examination, they were all different. Different designs, different perforations and/or different misplacement of the secret mark.

I know this is a small sample size, but if I could find that many in a random group, they have to be pretty common.
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Posted 06/20/2022   6:45 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Cephus to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
There are tons of sites out there selling forever stamps at 50% off, all of them fake. They've gotten really good at it and the most recent have tagging, foils, etc. Forgeries in modern stamps are ridiculously common, even recognized dealers have fallen for it.
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Posted 06/20/2022   7:12 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add serf_tide to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
It's interesting to say that the users are "the problem" when 99.999% of USA has no way to scan these stamps to see if they are tagged. My point is that the USPS is willfully missing this. There is a counterfeit statement on their website, but even the postal inspector report doesn't have a counterfeit reporting box. Shipping these should be a federal offense as Mail Fraud. There are a couple that I've bought, scanned and returned, pointing out that they are fakes and they continue to represent them as valid USA postage. Even eBay was kind of nonchalant about it. They took the names, but didn't act like it really mattered.
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Posted 06/20/2022   7:21 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add bobplates to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
..."This is an official Chinese government operation"

Politifact found that this statement was 100% false because it is an Unofficial Chinese government operation run by a "non sanctioned" agency of the CCP.

See truth telling is so damn relativistic these days.

Bob
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Posted 06/20/2022   7:42 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add serf_tide to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The whole thing kind of pisses me off. We talk about how the postal system needs to be solvent, but they could definitely put pressure on eBay and Amazon to clean this out. Maybe I'm being faked by ones that have tagging and still are not legit, but now I've purchased from 7 different dealers who have sent me untagged forever stamps. I'm sure that's a tiny blip compared to how much it is going on. I don't have a facebook account, so I'm not sure about the Marketplace there.

I'm going to contact both of my Senators here in Virginia and see if it registers at all with them.
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