Buyer Beware C13 Auction

Current auction for a US C13, being advertised as MNH, no issues, yet the seller includes an image with a PSE certificate number.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/314207622256

Lo and behold, the number matches the stamp when doing a cert search. Yet, the certificate states previously hinged with a pinhole
http://psestamp.com/Cert/01014480/

Sellers response:
"examined under a light no hole and not hinged."

The image of the back of the stamp in the eBay listing looks like it does have a pinhole at the right location. And although the perfs seem to generally match up with the stamp image on the cert, the stamp in the eBay listing appears to have fuzzy ends on some. Is that an indication that it has been regummed?

The guy doesn't know what he's talking about. Hinging is clear as a bell.

You can see two pin holes in the picture of the stamp . The first pin hole is between the 7th and 8th perf counting from the bottom left side 1/3 the way up on the stamp . The hinge is a darker tan area ,it didn't remove the gum but it stain the gum a different shade .

For what it is worth, here is an image showing "OGnh" on a PSE document.




___________________________________________________________^^^ OGnh^^^
If anyone cares, send the seller the scan of the PSE cert linked above and suggest he contact PSE to clear up then conflict.


Edited for better arrow placement.

Also, for what it is worth, the label is not a certificate. The certificate is the certificate. Probably just a data entry error for the label. PSE will not issue anything new because the actual certificate is correct.

For future reference once the sale is completed, here are the screen grabs from the eBay listing

You have to mention the listers name if you want the thread to show up in search engines (so buyers can make informed decisions). In this case the seller is kenwooddave and the listing screen shot is


If anyone contacts the seller, make them aware of this thread.
Don

You know that and I know that, but does the seller know that? Plus, why would the seller know anything about the underlying certificate if what is shown is all he has? If such is the case, he is being victimized by the PSE's apparent mistake and PSE makes mistakes such that I can no longer trust certain of their certificates.

I think the label is jus to ID the patient and it was how the stamp was submitted. Note the 90. I think this is an indication the submitter wants it to be graded on the cert if it is determined to be 90 or above. It didn't make that grade and is certed as ungraded.

eyeonwall is correct - this is an entry label showing details from the submission document for the order. It was submitted as NH with a minimum desired grade of 90 but did not attain that gum condition or grade.

As with many Ebay sellers you have to wonder what they know and when they knew it. "Ignorance" often times seems to go in one direction, the seller's favor.

so who should be responsible? the seller for misrepresenting or uninformed? a buyer for being lured in? an outside onlooker? Isnt this the exact problem the APS/ASDA thread is devolving toward? This is the elephant right here.

The seller's eBay store notes 18,000 items sold with the name 'Kenwood Stamps'. There is no mention of APS membership, ASDA, etc...

IMHO, any reasonable seller could easily see that the stamp matches the PSE certificate records. It's unfortunate that the seller denies the PSE evaluation.

This really is a good example of what buyers deal with on the internet selling platforms and a few thoughts quickly cross my mind as I look at the listing and the seller's store.

The C13 is way out of the norm for this seller who predominantly sells items in the low two figures range. Moving on we see that the seller deliberately does not mention or picture a certificate in the listing. Why? The cynic in me thinks that he "lost" it. The optimistic me says that he is ignorant of the process and is just going by the label. The cynic wonders why he is adamant about the stamp being MNH when it obviously is not the case. The optimist says that he is once again ignorant of how this all works. The optimist's thoughts do not pass the "smell" test. Bothe cynical and optimistic conclusions are reason to walk away from this seller. Whether ignorance or dishonesty you do not want to deal with this seller.

So how would an outside party deal with this non-APS/ASDA member? They could do nothing. Could you report the item to Ebay? Yes, and nothing will happen. The ONLY party that could intervene is fee-based Ebay and that problem will never go away.

PS: My conjecture is that the seller sent the stamp to PSE seeing $$$ and did not get what he had hoped for on top of eating the cost of the cert. Either that or it came out of a large catchall auction lot. Either way the only course of action is to move on.

The cert was issued 17 years ago. The note with the stamp is one unit as a mount holder. Who knows where the original cert is if it still exists as well as how did this item get into the seller's stock? Has the current owner even seen the original certificate? Also considering his sales tend to be low two figures why should he be expected to know how to look up an old certificate on line? Who knows the condition his eyes are functioning.

I agree though that this is a solid example of what "clean up" the APS, ASDA or combined will be facing if their goal is safer internet sales.