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Scott 116 With 8 Point Open Star - Why Grading Will Not Go Away

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Posted 11/17/2022   8:03 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add Parcelpostguy to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
This stamp just sold (not me) on eBay for $355.09 with free shipping. Scott Catalog value is $110 in the standard listings. So beside seeing a well centered example, I wonder how soon this will show up in a major auction as a graded stamp?

Yes here at SCF grading, not to put too fine a point on it, is somewhere in this range:



Yet if graded and returning with a paltry 95 it hits $850 and with just a 98 $2750.00 reached. Now the seller, jessica8a12, did not choose to get it graded but has a large text block discussing certification of purchases. That is to say the seller is aware of expertizing services.

However if it hits 98 or above, less the auction take, the buyer will be making some noticeable cash on the purchase and until that stops, grading will continue.

A discussion upon, including but not limited to, these observations, the centering, color, cancel, amount of cancel is asked for and encouraged. Well at least until it runs off the rails.










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Posted 11/17/2022   9:34 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rogdcam to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I think the heavy ill-defined cancel will never allow this well centered stamp to achieve a 95. If it somehow did get a 95 it still has to be attractive to a buyer and again, the cancel does it no favors.

For comparison this 116 graded 95 sold for $275 at Siegel:

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Posted 11/17/2022   10:48 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add mootermutt987 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I would agree with rogdcam, but I do think the top example is better centered than the graded example. That said, I am looking at the top perfs, and looking again and again. I wonder if they have been 'improved'. A good reperf is another good reason to not get a cert before selling. Then again, I could be wrong. I can imagine a universe where this gets graded at 98, barring any perf shenanigans.
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Posted 11/17/2022   11:45 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add caspian65 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Possibly re-perforated at the right?

Centering looks a little low, but the heavy cancel would likely keep it from a 95, even with it being a 'fancy cancel'.
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Posted 11/17/2022   11:52 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Parcelpostguy to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The rogdcam copy is showing slight discoloration (oxidizing) of the orange ink unlike the OP example. But damage aside, neither holds a candle to the vibrant color here: http://goscf.com/t/82412
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Posted 11/17/2022   11:53 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add hy-brasil to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
If a 95 is possible for the bottom stamp, a 95 or something close might be possible for the top one. The numerical grading method was stated to award up to 10 points based on aesthetic. So does a fancy/fancier cancel count for that factor? And the top stamp design can be seen through the cancel in the bottom stamp, only slightly less in the top stamp. The bottom stamp is oxidized, so that didn't count against it???

mootermutt, I think we're seeing something due to the lighting in scanning the top stamp. There are (deep) shadows inside the perf holes at top making them look more sharply cut. Here's a comparison of top and bottom and IMO I don't see any paper being removed from inside the top perf holes. Your mileage may vary.

I also think that the difference in paper color of the top and bottom is due to lighting during scanning.
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Posted 11/18/2022   12:20 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Any idea what the slight part of an ink impression, may be bottom left of top stamp?
Curious.
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Posted 11/18/2022   01:08 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Parcelpostguy to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Here is another 116 with the same cancel described by Siegel as 10c Yellow (116). Rich color, cancelled by bold strike of 8-pointed Star fancy cancel of San Francisco, wide and balanced margins, Extremely Fine, a scarce cancel, ex Saadi, with 1989 and 2002 P.F. certificates. Est. 400-500, Sold at $900 in sale 1004, lot 109 of the Gordon Eubanks Collection of 1869 Pictorial Issue.


This also shows minor toning/oxidization.
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Posted 11/18/2022   01:22 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add hy-brasil to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Parcelpostguy to the rescue once again. The last stamp (I think) provides the answer to rod's question. The mark noted looks red (not orange) to me and is then part of a transit mark like on the last stamp. It might be part of the exact same marking since the star cancel is same for the first and last stamp, the last stamp having an earlier state of the cancel. Depending on cancel usage, the first stamp may have been used a only few days after the last stamp.

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Edited by hy-brasil - 11/18/2022 01:26 am
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Posted 11/18/2022   07:56 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rogdcam to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Interesting discussion thus far which serves to point out the inherently risky nature of gambling on a "flip" if that is the intention of the buyer.

When reselling what impact does a name sale such as Eubanks have on bidding along with number of bidders, the economy, weather, number of similar items in the sale, bad internet connections, lethargy, caffeine intake, moon phase……..
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Posted 11/18/2022   09:21 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Parcelpostguy to the rescue once again. The last stamp (I think) provides the answer to rod's question. The mark noted looks red (not orange) to me and is then part of a transit mark like on the last stamp.


Brilliant! excellent sleuthing.
I had nothing in the way of explanation.
It was too close to be marginal inscription.

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Posted 11/18/2022   4:48 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add stallzer to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I think the stamp in the OP was a decent buy at $355. Beautiful stamp with a great cancel.
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Posted 11/18/2022   7:19 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rogdcam to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I am not convinced that the eBay buy was a great deal. All three of the stamps below went for $360 with tip in the Siegel Gorham sale this year. All had certs.



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Posted 11/18/2022   7:28 pm  Show Profile Check eyeonwall's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add eyeonwall to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Agree with rodg
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Posted 11/18/2022   7:38 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add revcollector to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
But none have the fancy cancel that the original stamp has. That certainly played a part.
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Posted 11/18/2022   10:22 pm  Show Profile Check orstampman's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add orstampman to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
On the OP stamp, I see a perforation crease at top (5 perforation tips from right on back scan), and possibly a perforation fault there as well continuing to adjacent perforation. I would be more concerned about condition being called out in the certificate (if submitted). Nonetheless - A Beauty!
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