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1890 Series Gum Question

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Valued Member
Japan
178 Posts
Posted 11/19/2022   09:49 am  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add Stephen-P to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
Hey guys, I was wondering why this piece doesn't have any gum whereas my other mint stamps in the series do.
I hope it wasn't because it was washed or something like that because it's centered quite nicely.
Thanks


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Pillar Of The Community
United States
8239 Posts
Posted 11/19/2022   09:59 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Petert4522 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Could just be used ?


Peter
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Pillar Of The Community
United States
575 Posts
Posted 11/19/2022   10:10 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add wtcrowe to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
All stamps in the 1890 small banknote set were issued with gum. The light red color on the reverse shows that the stamp has been soaked to remove from paper. The stamp shows a little darkness at lower right on the front so it may be used.
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Valued Member
Japan
178 Posts
Posted 11/19/2022   1:09 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Stephen-P to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for the replies!
Does that mean that they washed the postmark off of it? Can it be done as to not hinder the surface coloring?
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Valued Member
Japan
178 Posts
Posted 11/19/2022   1:14 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Stephen-P to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
And one more question: Would this mean that any eBay sale that claims "Mint - NG" is actually a washed stamp (If the series they are selling originally had gum)?
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Edited by Stephen-P - 11/19/2022 1:15 pm
Pillar Of The Community
United States
3157 Posts
Posted 11/19/2022   7:21 pm  Show Profile Check eyeonwall's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add eyeonwall to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
"And one more question: Would this mean that any eBay sale that claims "Mint - NG" is actually a washed stamp (If the series they are selling originally had gum)?"

If by washed you mean they removed a cancel, then no, most have not been washed. If by washed you just mean they had gum removed, then yes. There was a time when some collectors routinely removed the gum from their mint stamps out of fear for what the gum would do to the stamps over time. Also some stamps get stuck down due to poor storage and the main way to remove them without thinning them is to soak them off.
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Rest in Peace
United States
920 Posts
Posted 11/19/2022   7:43 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Caper123 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Homes were not air conditioned and many were quite humid inside. No doubt gum on stamps began to stick to whatever they were stored in, so gum was removed to prevent this by some. Because a stamp is listed in eBay as MNG does not mean it is truly mint. If the stamp's color seems weak it could be the cancel was removed - obviously not a 'mint' stamp. Use your own best judgement.
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Pillar Of The Community
4762 Posts
Posted 11/19/2022   7:58 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add John Becker to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
This stamp was the workhorse stamp of its era with huge quantities printed. There are many scenarios why/how this stamp lost its gum. The reason now does not matter, but the slight running of the non-fast ink suggests strongly that it was soaked, as wtcrowe noted. The standard black canceling ink is not really washable, so it is highly unlikely this stamp ever passed through the mail.

I would not get lost in the "mint" weeds of other's eBay descriptions, etc. The descriptions there must be taken with a large grain of salt to reduce the hype effect. This stamp is not "mint", but perhaps more accurately described as "unused, no gum". From a marketing standpoint, most collectors seeking a mint stamp want gum and those seeking a used stamp want an actual cancel, either light, fancy or otherwise interesting. Both collectors also lean strongly toward a copy perforated on all four sides. (and two short perfs at bottom center.) The stamp in question doesn't have much going for it from a demand angle.
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Edited by John Becker - 11/19/2022 8:01 pm
Valued Member
Japan
178 Posts
Posted 11/20/2022   12:37 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Stephen-P to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Makes a lot of sense! Thanks for the help!
I've read that this particular color was a problem for the mint because it tends to bleed more often than not, so I assumed that may have been the cause.
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Pillar Of The Community
United States
1645 Posts
Posted 11/20/2022   8:24 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add dudley to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Most eBay sellers (and many collectors, for that matter) tend to use the term "mint" to mean "unused," regardless of gum condition. This terminological issue has been debated elsewhere on this forum, but for me "mint" should be reserved to describe stamps as they were sold over the counter at the post office, i.e. uncancelled with full OG.
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Bedrock Of The Community
Australia
37483 Posts
Posted 11/20/2022   10:45 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply


Perhaps Mint = As exactly issued
to accommodate NGAI No Gum as Issued.
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Valued Member
Japan
178 Posts
Posted 11/22/2022   12:20 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Stephen-P to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I completely agree with that. It potentially lowers the value of actual 'mint' pieces when the term is thrown around loosely to accommodate multiple viewpoints. It should be as coins are, in that any coin showing signs of soaking/handling is then considered "circulated" rather than "uncirculated".
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Pillar Of The Community
United Kingdom
7033 Posts
Posted 11/22/2022   12:29 pm  Show Profile Check GeoffHa's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add GeoffHa to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
There are multiple meanings because stamps are collected around the world, not just one corner of it. In the UK, "mint" means a substantial amount of gum, but previous hinging etc. In France "neuf" has the same meaning. They're then qualified for stamps that haven't been hinged - "unmounted" in the UK, "sans charnière" in France.
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Valued Member
Japan
178 Posts
Posted 11/22/2022   12:40 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Stephen-P to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I would range the value of a stamp respectively as followed:
1. Mint (w/gum)
2. Mint Hinged (lightly to heavily depending on the situation)
3. Unmarked (meaning despite not being processed, there is either no gum or it has other medium to major flaws)
4. Marked (lost it's intrinsic value with a postmark).

Anything else (centering/desirable postmarks etc.) should fall into the realm of subjectivity, which could still potentially increase the stamp's value!
So #4 wouldn't necessarily always be the bottom of the barrel, only generally speaking.
Much like nice toning or punch marks could increase the value of a coin, a beautifully done postmark could accomplish the same. But it would be nice to keep those realms separate.
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Valued Member
Japan
178 Posts
Posted 11/22/2022   12:49 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Stephen-P to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
And would just make sense honestly rather than changing the definition of a word.
More often than not, such an un-agreed-upon plethora of meaning would just be taken advantage of by sellers artificially inflating a stamp's value with word-salad.
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Valued Member
Japan
178 Posts
Posted 11/22/2022   12:52 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Stephen-P to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Geoff you know a lot about the world! I guess that's what stamp collecting can do for a person!
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