Golden Oak June 3, 2023 Auction

Several auctions back, I bought what was advertised as a U.S. Scott 209b, the 10-cent 1882 Jefferson in black brown, used with a Maltese Cross cancellation (the main reason I bought it). Once I had the stamp in hand, the colour just didn't seem dark enough so I sent the stamp out to the APS for a cert. The cert came back as:
"Final opinion for certificate: 242671
United States, Scott 209, deep purple brown, used, maltese cross cancels, thinned perf at top right. Genuine."

In perusing the lots for tomorrow's auction, I was surprised to find what appears as the exact same stamp offered (lot # 327), STILL as a 309b, with no mention of my cert (which was returned along with the stamp, the refund being hassle-free, fwiw).

The image below is the one taken off of the APS' website in the 'My Certs' member's section:



I can't lift the image from the SAN website, but the image can be found at:
https://stampauctionnetwork.com/GO/go6017.cfm

Same stamp, yes?? I've been a regular customer of Golden Oak for quite a while, but now am forced to add them to my 'don't buy nuthin' unless it has a cert' category. Its getting harder and harder to fully trust any of the auction houses these days it seems (with the obvious exceptions like Siegel).

At the risk of becoming a blocked bidder, I may message the auctioneer when this lot comes up, asking, what the heck?

In their defense, an opinion is just an opinion, and in the auctioneer's opinion apparently they still believe it is a 209b. No offense to the APS, but I rank those certs one notch below PF and PSE (but still above PSAG). The PF and PSE, I believe, have much better spectrography equipment and reference collections than the APS for looking at color shades. What is a deep purple brown anyway, is that a real thing for that stamp, or just a made up shade variety?

If it were a PF or PSE certificate that they "misplaced", I would be more concerned. At least they did acknowledge the "trivial" thinned perf in the new listing.

Unfortunate that they didn't provide full disclosure. "The APS says it is a deep purple brown but we still believe it is a black brown." Your photo looks like a darkish brown. On SAN, side by side with a normal 209, the stamp looks a lot closer to what I would call a black brown versus most that I see on eBay, with or without certs. Colors are weird. (Especially when going through scanner software and other digital artifacts).

Glad to hear at least their return policy was hassle free. Thanks for alerting us to the full story behind that stamp.

No argument from me about 'opinions' and 'colour perception.'




Its this that sticks in my craw the most. Its like they're trying to hide something by not providing full disclosure.

Two thoughts on this.

Golden Oak should back up their claim by having gotten their own cert.

Golden Oak's opinion means nothing outside of Golden Oak world. Opinions may just be opinions but they are not all equal by any stretch. I have never seen Golden Oak mentioned in any auction house T&Cs as an accepted expertizing body (and never will).

Maybe the winner bidder should put it on extension this time. Hopefully it would get sent to the PF or PSE.

It sold for $65 (plus 20% tip) with no mention of the stamp's prior travels. I can only hope the buyer gets a cert...

May I ask when do you notify the house about wanting an extension?

In this stamp's case, I notified Golden Oak on the day I received the stamp, and they had no issue with the timing.

Redwood......were you the buyer? If you were, PLEASE let us (me) know how the cert comes back!!

Since the auction is still live (as I type, on a 5-minute break), I guess you could always message your intention directly to the auction house via 'Send a Message to the Auction Floor' (see button on pages of each lot) so they know right out of the gate.

It would be important to let the next expertizing group know of the APS' opinion. If you like, I can send you the info from my cert, although I don't have a copy of it.

I could and can you, docgfd, mention what you paid? This time the price is listed at $65 and that is so much below low estimate, I wonder if in fact it sold.


Now you can click on my image and it will open in a new window. Down size the window by compressing from the right side. Then move the horizontal scroll to the right until most of the white space is hidden. The reduce the window using "_" allowing you to now scroll up to the first post here. Then bring the image window back up and they are side by side for comparison.

That said, yes the same stamp.

EDIT: My take screenshot is being difficult and keeps cutting off the right side. Even now it is cutting off the bottom . So here is the right side of the listing with price, estimate and hammer.

Here's the full result in a single image. Click to enlarge.

IMO Golden has issues with reality/truth. Here is a 38 sold in today's sale that is stated to have "some minor oxidation at top".

One can always just take a screen shot, and paste the results into a graphics editor like Irfanview. Then crop the image as you wish and save. The image tends to be a tad blurrier than if you save the image from a website, but is usually adequate for discussion.

I am a bit surprised the cert didn't mention the missing perf at upper right. I've seen folks write that "flaws" are often mentioned in certs that aren't worth the mention. The completely missing perf on this stamp is a no-brainer.

Rog- Although I know very little about US stamps, I am familiar with oxidation seen on Commonwealth stamps, especially reds. There is color variation at the top of this stamp but to me, it doesn't look like oxidation.

What is your assessment of this stamp - in other words what tells you it's a big miss by the auction house?

The big miss is that the entire Golden Oak 38 is badly oxidized.

Normal 38:


Golden Oak 38:

Parcelpostguy - Its been long enough ago that I can't recall for sure, but believe it to have sold to me for $75 (plus tip).

Thanks Rog! Yes, quite obvious

Yes I remember back all of those so many hours back to long ago yesterday when that was how my "take screenshot" function worked. Perhaps my computer fell on a ramp or hit the top of a helicopter door and is feeling under the weather. That or that SAN hates me because I am not a registered (or paying) member.

That said, when I had started my many, many screenshots odyssey you post was not yet up. Oh well, practice help improvement.






Well the price changed in the correct direction with controversy. Hoped you were reimbursed for the cert cost which seems to have been read due to the inclusion of the perf thin.

Colors be darned, that is a nice struck cancel.