| Author |
 Replies: 44 / Views: 1,224 |
|
|
|
Pillar Of The Community
United States
8915 Posts |
|
|
Quote:
Statistics can be a pesky thing, but I will refrain. When you decide to quote them, try to remember that the population of the US in 1958 was 174,153,000. The population today is 334,233,854. So even if the statistics show an increase, it must be weighed by the fact of the current population being almost twice as large in the same territory space. |
Send note to Staff 
|
|
|
Pillar Of The Community
5145 Posts |
|
|
To return back to the topic of registered mail, please.... Parcelpostguy, you write: Quote:
I have published on this in the past with the agreement of other postal historians. Could you please provide a citation for those who wish to read it. Thank you. I have not seen any "X" marking before, but may have overlooked them. Having not read your writings on this subject, nor knowing the names of "other postal historians", it seems odd that registered mail being so controlled and detailed in its handling rules and regulations that anything could be "informal". How would any origin clerk know to mark a registered item and how would any clerk handing the item later know what it meant without documented rules/regulations? I admit initial skepticism, but will reserve final judgement. |
|
Send note to Staff
|
|
|
Bedrock Of The Community
10468 Posts |
|
|
Some more images of the gold being moved from NY to Fort Knox: Mail Trucks Waiting Outside NY Assay Office  Loading Gold at NY Assay Office  Loaded Mail Trucks  Loading Railcars  Railcars With Bullion  Train With Bullion  Bullion Boxes  Bullion Boxes on Cart  |
|
Send note to Staff
|
|
|
Pillar Of The Community
United States
5027 Posts |
|
|
Bedrock Of The Community
10468 Posts |
|
|
For the shipment of this bullion does anyone know or have an educated guess as to whether or not normal Registered Mail protocols/procedures would have applied such as USPOD forms and tags? I have been unable to find any sales records of such a thing. You would think that for a shipment that comprised thousands of boxes in hundreds of railcars over the course of five years something would have been saved if it existed. The entire shipment was handled by USPOD clerks and Postal Inspectors and the rail cars were under USPOD contract.
Also, I wonder if there was actually any postage paid even as a bookkeeping formality. |
|
Send note to Staff
|
|
|
Pillar Of The Community
United States
655 Posts |
|
|
I have not seen any tags or other evidence of a massive shippment of value either. However, Beecher page 228 notes that Act October 30, 1951 below the chart on that page:
Note: Over $15 million additional charges may by made based on consideration of weight, space, and value.
Was this practice used at an earlier date?
|
|
Send note to Staff
|
|
|
Bedrock Of The Community
10468 Posts |
|
|
I found some more detailed information on the shipments: Quote:
On January 13, 1937, the first shipment of gold from the New York Assay Office and the Philadelphia Mint would be made to the Bullion Depository at Fort Knox. Ships arrived semi-weekly between its first shipment in mid-January through June 17 of the same year. The United States Post Office oversaw the shipments as the gold would be transported from postal trucks onto trains accompanied by municipal police escorts. The train cars were armored and all postal workers were chaperoned by soldiers, mint guards, and secret service agents. A number of decoy train cars were employed as the gold was transferred from trains to Army trucks protected by another wave of soldiers and combat vehicles before making its way to the depository.
In this wave of gold transfers to the new building at Fort Knox, over 157 million troy ounces of gold was moved. After almost six months of movement, the entire shipment itself ended up representing nearly 45 percent of the total amount of United States gold reserves at the time. Four years later in early March of 1941, another shipment of over 258 million troy ounces was moved from the New York Assay Office to the bullion depository. This shipment to the vaults at Fort Knox, added to what was already being stored, increased the total amount of United States gold reserves represented to over 65 percent This new wave required seven months' time and countless train cars, moving vehicles, workers, and security measures. Edit to add source: https://www.thecoinvault.com/produc...at-fort-knox |
|
Send note to Staff
|
| Edited by rogdcam - 06/08/2023 12:00 pm |
|
|
Pillar Of The Community
United States
765 Posts |
|
|
Fascinating stuff…thanks for posting Rog.
Wouldn't it have been something if just one of the many shipments went postage due.
And now I am suddenly thinking of season 1 of Babylon Berlin, which revolves around the pursuit of Russian gold by several actors/entities during the Weimar Republic. Gold!!!!
|
|
Send note to Staff
|
-- Jonathan |
|
|
Pillar Of The Community
5145 Posts |
|
|
Rogdcam, Gentle request, that when you post search results of photos or quotes that you cite the source or provide links. It makes it so much easier for the rest of us tracking down future information in a scholarly way, etc. Thank you. |
|
Send note to Staff
|
|
|
Pillar Of The Community
United States
6788 Posts |
|
|
There is another part of this story ,this was shipments between 1937 and 1941 correct . This other part was the movement of national treasures from many other countries to the safety of the U.S. for their Gold . I am not sure if this was kept in N.Y.C. banks or transfered to other places like Ft.KNOX .
Since these were war years ,we also had other nations buying war supplies from the U.S. again we had gold shipments for purchases coming into U.S. and that Gold needed needed assayed too . My thinking there was a lot of private Gold coming in for U.S. banking safe keeping . |
|
Send note to Staff
|
|
|
Pillar Of The Community
United States
6788 Posts |
|
|
On the subject of postal tags for Gold ,I never seen a U.S. tag , but I do have postal tags from the Australian Gold Fields with high value Australian stamps on them going to a assay office.
I shown then on the old EBAY stamp chat board , David B. from Australia told me on the board , that they will bring "big money " if I ever wanted to sell them . |
|
Send note to Staff
|
|
|
Valued Member
United States
185 Posts |
|
|
Quote:
On the subject of postal tags for Gold ,I never seen a U.S. tag I don't know if you meant in general, or only tags for bars of gold transferred between banks. Alaska gold tags are "relatively" common, here is one that sold recently on eBay (not to me).   The tag does not have any high value stamps because of the special "Gold Rate" from Alaska. The gold rate was a special rate for gold shipments from Alaska back to the US. The rate was set at the First Class rate -- 2 cents per ounce in this instance -- with mandatory registration, and with the item receiving treatment as Parcel Post matter. In this instance, the rate is 5 times two cents plus 10 cents registry fee. Five ounces of raw gold at the time would have been worth approximately $85.00 but the maximum indemnity included in the registry fee was $50.00. An article from Linns has more information, and a picture of another parcel tag for shipping gold. https://www.linns.com/news/us-stamp...istered-mail Brief Info about Bethel: https://alaskagoldrush.info/Mineing...s/Bethel.htm |
|
Send note to Staff
|
|
|
Bedrock Of The Community
10468 Posts |
|
|
Quote:
Rogdcam, Gentle request, that when you post search results of photos or quotes that you cite the source or provide links. It makes it so much easier for the rest of us tracking down future information in a scholarly way, etc. Thank you. Fair point John. I will go back and plug in the info later today. |
|
Send note to Staff
|
|
|
Pillar Of The Community
United States
2426 Posts |
|
|
Quote:
Alaska gold tags are "relatively" common, here is one that sold recently on eBay (not to me). It is my tag as I was the buyer. These tags going to that store in San Francisco are relatively common as the company moved much gold between themselves and received much from customers paying for goods. The only reason I picked that one up is that it had a SF receiving cancel, the first I have noticed on this large correspondence. The gold rate from mines to assay office hit four figures are are quite rare. Such has been discussed in other SCF threads. The less expensive ones run just high three figures. The one posted by ZebraMan which I one ran $44 plus $1.5 S&H from where else, Alaska. Edited to correct poster's name. |
|
Send note to Staff
|
| Edited by Parcelpostguy - 06/08/2023 11:42 am |
|
|
Pillar Of The Community
United States
2426 Posts |
|
|
Quote:
Could you please provide a citation for those who wish to read it. Thank you. John Becker, I advise you that you will not like the fact this "x" use has occurred for decades with no formal comments, pro nor con in the postal guides. Word of mouth does travel. Likewise you will find no information written in the postal guides as to why "x" and only "x' has been used.
Transition from Domestic Air Parcel Post to Priority Mail February 2018 The US Specialist. There was no letter to the editor blow-back in the following months. Speaking of gold:   This tag was an 8 lb shipment of gold, including weight of packaging; send as newly required by Priority Mail. Airmail items over 7 ounces were all transferred to the new Priority Mail service which began January 7, 1968. For those reading the article, there is one earlier recorded similar usage also with Liberty stamps in the Liberty exhibit of Wade Saade. |
|
Send note to Staff
|
|
|
Replies: 44 / Views: 1,224 |
|
Posted 06/06/2023 5:04 pm
