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PF vs PSE Grading Experience  
 

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Pillar Of The Community
United States
1372 Posts
Posted 09/13/2017   12:45 am  Show Profile Check eyeonwall's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add eyeonwall to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I wouldn't fo so far as to say a stamp graded 85 or 90 is not worth a premium, but the premium might not be worth the cost of the cert (would depend on the stamp issue in question).

As for the original question, PSE is more commonly used for grading.
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Valued Member
190 Posts
Posted 09/13/2017   07:50 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rogdcam to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
In my own personal experience stamps with certs, no matter the numerical grading, are much easier to sell. The certs add a comfort level for many buyers. If I list a set of zeps with certs and a set without certs it is gauranteed that the former will sell very quickly and for a higher price. The 100 dollars spent on certing a set pays for itself and if they end up being a lowly 85 it still adds to the value based on SMQ. As far as others that have commented that the market for lower grade numbers is weak I have never experienced that.
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Valued Member
United States
431 Posts
Posted 09/13/2017   08:12 am  Show Profile Check srailkb's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add srailkb to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
To get back to the original question, I think (in general) PF is a harder grader, although many exceptions exist. My guess is that if you were to examine realizations of PF- and PSE-graded stamps, PF-graded would realize a slightly higher percentage of SMQ on average, and the reason for that is the buyer is likely going to resubmit to PSE and get the higher grade :-) Those who collect graded stamps generally prefer PSE, use SMQ values, etc. They would need to know PSE's number anyway, so they can add it to their PSE-registered set.

IMO, none of these Zepps are worth grading, but as others have said, clean certs add value to an otherwise ungraded stamp, so still OK to get certs on stamps like these. The question is will they add enough value to justify their cost (...and justify the risk of having them call something ridiculous, like a tiny NGB or inclusion, thereby ruining the value entirely...)

The graded stamp market has certainly changed a lot over the last 10 years. IMO, a "low" grade (that is, 90 or below) will actually DECREASE the value of the stamp vs. an ungraded cert. Others have mentioned/hinted at it, but I'll say it this way: the market today for 80's, 85's & 90's is extremely thin - those who collect graded stamps now want upper end of the census (and none of these will qualify). Those who don't collect graded stamps don't want ANY number on their cert. Having a graded 85 Zepp is in a "void" right now.
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Pillar Of The Community
United States
635 Posts
Posted 09/13/2017   6:00 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rgstamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I'm in the "thin" market population because I collect classic, mainly 19th century US, used, in VF-XF condition.
I like stamps graded 85-90 the most due to price. They look great in my album. Very few can afford the 95-98 graded stamps... I'll take a scott #15 graded 85-90 for 150- 200 bucks over the 95-98 selling for 1000-2500$. I'll let the big boys spend thousands per stamp, not my thing. But show me a fault free graded 85, scott 20... I'm excited and in my price range. Hopefully it will stay that way. I'm willing to pay a small premium for a graded 85 than an advertised ungraded VF-XF not for collecting purposes, but because resale value may be slightly higher. Perhaps I am in the minority here. I buy graded and ungraded stamps. Don't care either way. But reality is there are so few classic 19th century fault free stamps graded 95 or higher. You are talking about enough stamps to satisfy the demand of perhaps 20 super wealthy collectors worldwide.
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Valued Member
190 Posts
Posted 09/13/2017   6:51 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rogdcam to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Srailkb and rgstamp - Great posts. Very insightful. I tend towards your POV rgstamp. I do not buy stamps for their grade but if it is a part of the cert for a stamp I like then so be it.
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Pillar Of The Community
United States
1217 Posts
Posted 09/13/2017   7:59 pm  Show Profile Check sinclair2010's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add sinclair2010 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Geesh, I guess I will have to work on my delivery. I think I said the same thing as Mr. Srail
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United States
50 Posts
Posted 09/13/2017   8:01 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add StampsInWV3 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Those stamps are awesome to me. I grade them all 100.
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Pillar Of The Community
United States
1372 Posts
Posted 09/13/2017   9:43 pm  Show Profile Check eyeonwall's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add eyeonwall to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I can't afford 95 and up, but would be perfectly happy with 85 and 90 and do expect to pay more (than for an 80) and would expect to pay more for one with a cert (I would value the identification/genuine/fault free aspect of the cert more than the grading, but I do not agree the grading is worthless). So put me in RG's camp.
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Pillar Of The Community
United States
720 Posts
Posted 09/13/2017   11:24 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add JLLebbert to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Add me to the RG & eye camp as well. I agree emphatically with all of the previous post. I would add that the generally steep expense in going from grade 90 to 95 (or 95 to 98) doesn't seem to me to be merited by the differences in quality. Of course, the law of supply & demand dictate otherwise. And, as a general rule, PF seems to grade more conservatively than PSE.
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Valued Member
190 Posts
Posted 09/14/2017   07:38 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rogdcam to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Let's face it. The uber high grade stamps trade amongst a tiny group of folks that recycle them amongst themselves endlessly. The meat and potatos for PSE's grading business are the numerically challenged stamps that exist in large numbers. Without those the entire scheme would collapse. The 98 and 100's of the world are sexy, draw attention and give hope of the "find". They are akin to the flagship automobile models that drive people to buy there lesser brethren in order to partake in the party.
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Pillar Of The Community
United States
935 Posts
Posted 09/14/2017   10:30 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add cjpalermo1964 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Not that there's anything wrong with that ...
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Valued Member
190 Posts
Posted 09/14/2017   10:38 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rogdcam to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Nothing wrong with that at all. #128526;
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Valued Member
United States
290 Posts
Posted 09/14/2017   10:46 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add alub to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I find the grading to be far more subjective than PSE and PF claim. I see stamps graded 100 with perf that look short to me. Or that don't have a particularly good impression. Or have a very ugly cancellation. But they are really nicely centered.

I upgrade stamps in my collection on a regular basis. Yes, I try for well centered stamps with large margins. But I also am attracted to how they are canceled. One series I am trying to fill the page with stamps canceled in blue. So for me, an upgrade might not be perfectly centered, but the cancel matches the rest of the stamps on the page.

Bottom line is we should all collect what we want, and don't worry about what others collect.
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Pillar Of The Community
United States
635 Posts
Posted 09/14/2017   11:08 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rgstamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The biggest downside with grading is that it is primarily a "centering" system. Yes they downgrade for heavy cancels, shortish perfs, etc.... but they never "upgrade" for a stamp with full perforations all the way around, crisp impression, face free cancel, tremendous bright color, light cancel...I can go on with these attributes that can make a great stamp.... but no reward is given.... in my brain I look for these attributes that grading systems feel free to not reward.
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Valued Member
United States
390 Posts
Posted 09/14/2017   11:30 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add txstamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I love great impressions on the early line engraved stamps. You can't beat em. A #10 or a #1 with a high quality impression grades high on my scale any day, even with lesser margins.
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