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Does Grading Matter???

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Posted 06/28/2017   1:31 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add canyoneer to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
I am considering returning a recently purchased stamp to a dealer. The stamp came with a PSE cert that states "it is genuine unused, o.g., never hinged". Upon very close inspection, a few perfs on one edge show faint traces of a guideline. I believe that sometime in the past someone made an attempt to remove the guideline. The cert photo does not show the guideline so if the stamp had been altered, it was altered before the certification. I've sent an email to PSE with the cert no. in hopes that they have further info on file for this particular stamp. Has anyone run into this? The whole idea of feeling safe buying expensive stamps with a cert was blown out of the water for me on this experience. Back to working on my world wide collection of cheap stamps. What do you think?
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Posted 06/28/2017   2:06 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add John Becker to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Two thoughts come to mind:
1. expertizing (which your stamp seems to have) and grading (which it doesn't seem to have) are two different things. Is it actually graded?

2. a scan of the stamp and the certificate would be helpful to obtain meaningful feedback. Also, the grain of the photo can make it difficult to see a "faint trace" as you describe it. Depending on the plate layout, some stamp issues have perforated guide lines on one or two edges. Knowing each stamp issue can be identify some reperfing jobs.
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Edited by John Becker - 06/28/2017 2:07 pm
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Posted 06/28/2017   3:15 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add jconey to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I'd have to agree with John, post a photo and if possible a high res close up of the area of concern.

I wouldn't necessarily be willing to throw in the towel on a single deal that didn't go well... If that was the norm, nobody with a decent sized collection would have a collection.

I'd also like to hear the answer to John's question (#1) above and what PSE has to say.

Jeff
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Posted 06/28/2017   3:28 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add canyoneer to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Here's a close up of the perfs - tough to get a good scan. You can just barely see evidence of a purple line on a few of the perfs (or possibly my imagination). Also, I included a picture of that part of the cert. I realize that this issue is perfed along the horizontal guidelines but I've heard from others that a visible line, even on a perfed guideline, is considered a downgrade thus creating an incentive for removing. This is a PSE cert without grading from 2003.



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Posted 06/28/2017   4:02 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Oracle of Delphi to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I would also be curious about the answer to the question of whether a visible line - guide line or other - is a detriment to stamp value and why that would be so. I have a few stamps, none particularly valuable, with that phenomenon. Thanks.
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Posted 06/28/2017   4:33 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add John Becker to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Please show scans of the entire stamp and the entire certificate. Dribbling out information in bits and pieces will not get quality responses, if at all.

Otherwise, this is Scott 325, the 3 cent Louisiana Purchase issue, which as you note, has naturally perforated horizontal guide lines. In this case, so visibly inconsequential that there was not need to mention it on a certificate. Whether a guideline is an asset or a detriment to a stamp depends on the particular stamp issue and the collector - the sword cuts both ways.
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Posted 06/28/2017   5:07 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rgstamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I think there are faint traces of the guideline on the certificate although it is blurry.

I presume this is a highly graded stamp above or at 95. Obviously PSE felt this guideline was inconsequential in the grading of the stamp. So question is why worry....?

Now my pessimistic demeanor.... I believe you if you think someone altered the stamp to fade out the guideline enough to be of no consequence in grading it. This has been done before. Why wasn't it picked up by PSE?

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Posted 06/28/2017   5:11 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add canyoneer to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Oracle -

PSE considers these perfed guidelines "naturally occurring fault" and downgrades it in the grading. Personally I disagree, if anything, it can prove that particular edge is not re-perforated (if it is on a naturally perforated guide line edge). I do not think that it diminishes appearance. But, since the graders say so, people would avoid them because their "value" would be less. Below is a clip from PSE website that talks about guidelines.

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Posted 06/28/2017   6:10 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add revcollector to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Actually they are responding to an long held collector feeling that guidelines are less desirable unless in pairs or blocks. Calling it a fault is overstating it IMO, but they do have less value.
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Posted 06/28/2017   6:40 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Rhett to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
rgstamp, the OP says this is NOT a graded certificate, so your presumption is wrong.
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Posted 06/28/2017   6:45 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add jconey to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I agree , I wouldn't call it a fault as it's a intentional feature of the BEP printing process. Some collectors prefer what they consider "pristine" stamps. No deviations, no extraneous marks even if by the BEP.

I personally don't agree with that, but to each their own. The value or detriment is really up to the individual collector. I have a thing for plate number singles... I wonder if PSE also considered that a detriment.

Jeff
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Posted 06/28/2017   6:45 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Rhett to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I agree with revcollector. Stamps that show a guideline on perforations of single stamps are not faulty but are considered by many collectors to be less desirable. The soundness is not affected but the value is diminished.
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Posted 06/28/2017   6:57 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rgstamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Rhett, I missed that.

So what is issue here? That PSE missed an intentional alteration that should have been listed as a major fault on cert.? I think that is why OP is upset

or

Scant amount of ink from guideline is visible decreasing value of stamp slightly, but so insignificant it would never be mentioned on a cert?

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Posted 06/28/2017   7:03 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rgstamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Recently discussed intentional versus unintentional removal of line on stamp


http://goscf.com/t/54837
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Posted 06/28/2017   7:59 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Oracle of Delphi to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thank you all for your insights - always wondered about the guideline issue. I also have quite a few pairs with guidelines but in those cases, it appears from the catalog values I see as well as auction results that its possibly a plus, not a minus. Sorry to digress from the OP's original issue.
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Posted 06/29/2017   12:28 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Douglas Andrew Willinger to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Some ink markings at a stamp's extremities can be quite interesting and potentially valuable.

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Edited by Douglas Andrew Willinger - 06/29/2017 12:30 pm
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