Scott 1286 Having Trouble Seeing Tagging

Hello again friends.

I am having trouble detecting tagging on Scott 1286.

I am using a prinz shortwave desk lamp. I was easily able to see tagging multiple other stamps that have the wide block, narrow block etc. as well as the stripe on the 100 years of mail order stamp. So I don't think the issue is the uv light.

I referenced the stamp smarter database, and it shows overall tagging definitively green. However I've looked at the 30-40 used copies of this stamp that I have and have seen nothing remotely close to the tagging illustrated in the database.

I also viewed a few of the stamps under LW to see if the ink was reactive as well, did not see much.

What am I missing here?

I highly doubt I have so many stamps with tagging omitted.

Ive googled around as well as searched these forums to see if there is something special with this stamp but am not coming up with any answers.

I appreciate any assistance.

Tagging on used stamps may be difficult to see. Did you try looking at a Mint stamp for comparison?

Is the bulb in the unit have clear or purple glass? Shortwave UV tubes of the 4w type are a clear bulb. A separate purple colored filter is then used to filter the output of the bulb. All the purple colored 4w bulbs I have seen are LW/blacklight tubes. Some of the handheld battery units with the clear SW bulbs are also sold with a clear lens and while these work for seeing some US tagging, it doesn't always show the tagging especially if the tagging is light or washed out as it can be on those early overall tagged and used stamps.
Mark S

Thanks for your responses~!

Unfortunately, I don't have a mint to view at the moment. I will soon though.

Mark: Interesting. It has clear glass. Here are the replacement tubes they sell:
https://www.prinzverlag.de/en/uv-te...-tube-256-nm

Is there any way to create or buy a filter?

I was wondering if there was too much light coming from the bulb or something. This would make sense.

Is there any way to create or buy a filter?

Not really for "average" people.

First of all, the violet stuff in a lw lamp is not a filter. It usually is a polymer tacked onto the inside of the tube that absorbs (most of the) 254nm short wave uv and then reemits light in the long wave uv 365nm region. What you usually get out of cheaper lamps is a mix of long-wave uv, some residual short wave uv light and some visible light into the blue wavelength region. Most of the lw lamps used for gemstones have quite a significant contribution in the blue wavelength region.

Expensive long-wave uv have a thick polymer layer that emit light mainly in the 365nm region. LED lamps also exist that emit in the 395nm region but with noticeable light amounts in the blue region. For short wave tubes (that also emit some visible light), filters can be bought that absorb all visible light (HOYA Fusion Next).

For some peculiar reason, commercial uv lamps usually way overstate the Wattage number. I built my own lamps (8W sw and lw), and the sw lamp immediately produces ozone. I have never seen/smelled that with commercial lamps that state the same or even higher wattages.

What you pointed too is a SW UV I expect. issue as pointed out above is the lack of a filter. I don't recommend the name brand replacement bulbs such as the prinz one you point out. Way to over priced. You can buy generic ones for six to ten dollars. Your best bet is to buy a lamp with correct filter. For home use I have the 11w version from uvtools.com. I like it a lot and found batteries last fairly long and it is somewhat portable. I have no affiliation with uvtools just like the lamp and its price. Otherwise get the handheld 4w battery version. This also works well, and is portable so easy to take to shows. Just make sure it has the purple glass filter in it. Some have a clear glass instead. Note, I describe it as purple glass or purple filter as that is easiest way to describe it. Again don't buy the name brand ones, unless you want to pay 2-3x over a generic bulb. When I first got into tagging I bought a lamp with clear glass just to see how it worked and found it didn't work well if at all.

I went ahead and ordered the uvtools shortwave long wave 11W. Excited for it to arrive.

Bought on Monday the 23rd and USPS says still waiting for the package. I sent them an email.

Thanks for the suggestion. I think the higher wattage as well as the filter will help significantly

Once you reach 50 posts if you have questions, you can contact me. Always happy to answer questions directly as well.

The hanheld lamp is an F4 t5 lamp. In flourescent lamps , generally in order to use a higher wattage lamp, the ballast/ or solid state /electronic circuitry must be able to output the proper amount of energy demanded by the lamp. The fixture usually states the output or maximum size lamp to use, or possibly risk a fire from overload. So a 4 watt power supply will probably not illuminate an 11 watt lamp. As well, usually the higher the wattage, the longer/larger the lamp, so it may not fit the 4watt lampholders. And be careful not to put a shortwave lamp in a handheld unit designed for longwave, or you can get a nasty sunburn over time, and it is hazardous to your eyes if you look directly at it. Lighthouse used to put out a shortwave handheld unit but it had a plastic guard covering most of the tube with a small slot to check tagging without exposing user to any hazard. They stopped producing that model in favor of a more expensive combination long/ shortwave model.

The 11W is an entirely new unit from uvtools.

These are the handhelds people usually talk about:



At top the long wave handheld (sw tube with inside polymer coating).
At bottom the short wave handheld (sw tube without coating).

Both tubes glow "in all directions". The sw tube has an attachable plastic cover that absorbs the light except in the middle third (which also has a plastic filter on top to somewhat filter out the visible light). With the plastic cover attached, only light shining straight up will leave the lamp through the filter. (There also is a small 2mm hole in the plastic to let unfiltered light out).

Both lamps use 4 AA batteries (might not run on rechargeable batteries but I haven't tested that).

How "dangerous" are the lamps you might ask, hearing all the stories about sw uv "instantly burning your eyes".
The handhelds operate with 4 AA batteries at round 5.7-6V. What is amazing how much current they draw (once the tubes have started which takes more power for a short moment). The current typically is right below 0.4mA. That's MILLIAmperes. So the electric power going into the lamp is less than 2Milliwatts (the small electronic circuitry will eat some power). When switched on, the sw tube emits bright white light so you can easily detect if the tube is on. The lw tube with the polymer also emits white light so it is always possible to see if the tubes are on or off, even in daylight.

With the plastic attached, roughly 95% of the sw uv light is absorbed by the plastic so you get less than 0.1Milliwatts of sw uv. You might damage your eyes if you hold the plastic right onto your eyes. Even with the plastic removed (and holding the tube away from you), there is no danger of damaging your eyes.

Notice the sw tube is heavily used. The filter in the plastic tube probably has degraded to the point of no longer usable to filter out (some) visible white light.

It would be interesting to measure the actual current going into the 8/11W uvtools lamp.

The uvtools unit uses a F11T5 bulb and not the F4T5 bulb used in most smaller handheld units. It is a significantly larger bulb. You can definitely smell the ozone after having it on awhile.

The black 4w units I have contain a glass filter the looks dark purple. I know they are glass because I dropped one and broke the filter in half. I also have the red ones shown above. It doesn't work well for tagging based on my experience because it doesn't have the proper filter. Almost all the images in the stampsmarter tagging database were taken with my 4w hand held unit.

The silvering of the bulb end can be slowed/minimized by not constantly turning the bulb on and off. If you have a bunch of stamps to work through better to leave the bulb on which extends the bulb life. If one end of the bulb is highly silvered and won't light easily, try turning to bulb end for end. This works for the 4w units I have used.

I received the UV tools 11W lamp today and holy cow it is a night an day difference!

All the stamps I was struggling with before are now clearly visible. I accumulated a pile of them while I was waiting for it to arrive.

Thank you for the suggestion! Remarkable!

Here is a stamp under the Prinz



And here is the stamp under UVtools.

Whatever your Prinz thingie is, it obviously emits light in the short uv, long uv and visible light range, all at the same time The result is the mess we see in your image....

Yep. The funny part is they advertise it for stamps.

https://www.prinzverlag.de/en/uv-te...ains-powered

Here is a comparison of the two lamps I use. Top is uvtools and bottom kid a generic one I bought on ebay. Various stamp suppliers sell a name brand version of the lower 4w units at 2-3x the price I paid. you can see the broken glass I taped together on the bottom unit. Small one I take to shows and sometimes the larger one. Larger unit is great for sorting through kiloware looking for tagging freaks and errors.



By not turning the light on these units on and off constantly, I have only had to replace the bulb in the smaller unit. Larger one still going strong after three plus years.