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1860's British Revenue ID Help Needed-Tin Seal

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Pillar Of The Community

United States
548 Posts
Posted 05/25/2011   5:31 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add fincbob2451 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
Hello, This British revenue stamp was on a large indenture document I purchased. It was to large to scan (21"x24").The stamp has from the top down--1 pound 15 shillings and below that 2 shilling 6 pence. It has a London cancel woth a crown in the center and dated 18-5-67 with a capital P below the date. I didn't see this in the Scott catalog so I assumed they may be in a specialized catalog. Thank you for any help.
David







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Edited by fincbob2451 - 12/08/2011 1:02 pm

Pillar Of The Community
Canada
2277 Posts
Posted 05/25/2011   6:08 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add nitrolures to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Can't help on the revenue but what a great document. I've never seen a solid color revenue like that and the amount is quite high for the period.
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Pillar Of The Community
United States
548 Posts
Posted 05/25/2011   6:45 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add fincbob2451 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Hello nitrolures It is quite a large document and beautifully written. I can't imagine how long it took to write.
David
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Pillar Of The Community
United States
5894 Posts
Posted 05/25/2011   7:05 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add smauggie to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
With lead slugs, no less. Wow. Thanks for sharing. Very specialized collecting area.
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Pillar Of The Community
United States
548 Posts
Posted 05/25/2011   7:09 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add fincbob2451 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi smauggie, That's interesting, I had no idea the stamp was affixed with lead. thanks for that info.
david
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Pillar Of The Community
Canada
2277 Posts
Posted 05/25/2011   7:12 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add nitrolures to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Wow didn't realize that was lead. I thought cancellation punches but lead? I melt and cast with lead almost daily in my fishning tackle manufacturing and it is super soft and even though it takes 650=800 degrees to melt it cools extremely fast so I could see it not causing damage regardless how it was used.
Someone on here has to have some knowledge on this beauty.
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Pillar Of The Community
United States
7072 Posts
Posted 05/25/2011   7:52 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Cjd to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The paper is glued to the document to give a better base for a seal's impression, and then the silver pieces permanently affix the paper onto the document. Another label goes on the back side, over the metal, to act as a seal. (I'm not sure if that seal/label was universal, or not.) I have one lying around that I'll dig up and scan.
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Bedrock Of The Community
Australia
38679 Posts
Posted 05/26/2011   01:35 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I am glad Cj chipped in
I thought it was silver not lead.

New Zealand have similar rvenues with silver seals IIRC.
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Pillar Of The Community
United Kingdom
3211 Posts
Posted 05/26/2011   03:11 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add nigelc to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I believe these are tin strips.
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Nigel
Bedrock Of The Community
Australia
38679 Posts
Posted 05/26/2011   03:39 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Ah! yes Nigel,
I recall now that NZ were indeed tin strips.
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United States
7072 Posts
Posted 05/26/2011   09:38 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Cjd to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Sorry, I didn't mean "silver" as in the element...I meant silver as in the color. My lack of precision was unhelpful. "Silver" the element would be pretty much black by now.
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Canada
2277 Posts
Posted 05/26/2011   10:06 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add nitrolures to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
So judging by the impression in tin being in line with the text of the revenue is it safe to assume that the revenue was simply a blank pc of blue paper and then stamped accordingly to thus make it a revenue?
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United States
5894 Posts
Posted 05/26/2011   10:14 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add smauggie to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I should have said that it was an assumption that it was lead. The Vatican uses lead to seal certain documents.
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United States
7072 Posts
Posted 05/26/2011   12:37 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Cjd to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
If you are looking for some light reading, seek out:

The Impressed Duty Stamps of Great Britain: A Priced Catalogue of Embossed Non-Adhesive Fiscal Stamps (1694 to the Present Time) by Scholfeld et al., 375 pages of revenue fun.

nitro, your assumption is correct. The paper is affixed to the document, and then the embossed impression is made.


[edit: This page has a great shot of how the cypher seals were used on the backs of the stamps to seal the metal strips, along with plenty of information on Australian state seals...apologies in advance to any of you who weren't looking for something else to seek out...
http://www.ozrevenues.com/Articles/cypher.htm ]
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Edited by Cjd - 05/26/2011 12:49 pm
Pillar Of The Community
United States
548 Posts
Posted 05/26/2011   1:45 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add fincbob2451 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Hello, That is a great link cjd. It said no fee was charged so they are not considered a revenue and were never sold to the public. Would this still be considered a stamp of some sort or more along the lines of a cinderella?
Thanks
David
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Pillar Of The Community
United States
3568 Posts
Posted 05/26/2011   2:08 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add jhlovell to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Here is a little bit about the paperwork, or at least what it known as Saundridge Manor.
http://www.hertfordshire-genealogy....1762-doc.htm
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