A Few More To Identify

Collin, Rod, the 4 characters of the overprint on your Manchurian stamps read "Republic of China" in traditional script.

Thanks, k, I hope someone can confirm or reject Chang Chun as the locale.

Marc, that is no splotch. In person, does it look more like 78Q or 780? It is interesting that color seems to have transferred on the reverse. If someone wasn't just playing around, I'd infer that stamps were stacked during production. Other explanations?

The Facit catalogue only lists two varieties for your 1.5k stamp...ordinary paper and phosphorescent paper. No mention of any "splotches" that I could find.

Thanks khj.



Oh! I see, I had not considered that.
thanks for your suggestion,
I have not read that explanation before.

That conflicts with what I understood that
Manchukuo used Jpanese style dates based on the
Japanese Emperor's era.
Pu Yi became emperor in 1934.

Are you sure on your dating system?

So it reads 780 plus top of an arrow or roof or whatever
which runs up the stamp.
Not much to go on, this type of thing you
store away in your image gallery, to bring up when you see something similar.
1960 usage could explain a lot of things colour, auxilliary marking etc
Just keep an eye out for covers of a similar vintage.

Manchukuo used a Japanese-style dating system, but not measured on the Japanese emperor's reign. Even a puppet state has to have its limitations...1932 and 1933 were years 1 and 2 of the new country, and 1934 was year 1 of Pu-Yi as emperor. So you add 1933 to the Manchukuo year to get our year (as long as we aren't talking about the first year 1 or 2). Keeping the math straight is maddening. I keep thinking 1933 is the first year of the reign...

Yes, it looks like the number 780 as you said or possibly 78Q. I don't see the plus, but maybe that is what the other splotch is. What caught my eye is the heavy impression it left on the stamp which made me think it is not part of the cancel. As you see, it nicely pressed through the paper and left it raised on the back.

By the way, sorry to bring this stamp back again, but I was going through some of the stamps I had put into my spread sheet already, double checking them, and I couldn't find this one on the list. Someone had kindly helped identify it before and I had marked it down as Yugoslavia NB19 from 1944 on the dealer card it is in with an approximate catalog value of $10. I looked again under Yugoslavia and I couldn't find any catalog references to NB. Maybe it is under Italy in the occupied countries area? I guess I am not looking in the right place and why I can't find it. But I did a search in my spread sheet for NB19 and nothing came up. So I did not log it either it seems. Too many details and not enough brain power :)

Marc, the ID of NB19 and catalog price are both correct.

In the Scott catalog, look at the back of the Yugoslavia listings. After the airmail, postage due, postal tax... and whatnot, should be the occupation listings. You will find it in the occupation listings.

Regarding the cancellation on the Manchurian stamp overprinted "Republic of China". The Japanese would in general not allow such an overprinted stamp to be used in areas under its control. I would think these stamps were used in areas that were back under control of China, not Japan. So I would think the canceller used would also no longer be using the Japanese year-date, but either the ROC year or the Western year designation. Just my thoughts. I know little about cancels.

Cjd, Interesting find. But I have reservations about what it is.
I have the Kerr Catalogues of 1975 it is similar to what you believe it could be is T25. Looking at the one Rod22 posted it appears to be a T25, the difference to me is that your examples are clean nicely printed and with finer details with the Chinese characters.

The date of 14-2-1945 is another concern. These provisional overprints were created during the end of a standard postal system during the Soviet Russian invasion starting August 9,1945 & seized completely by the August 15. The Russian Soviets stay in control until May of 1946 when it was agreed to return the area back to China.
But which China, The Soviets back the Reds, the US the Nationalists each adding their own overprints, all ending in 1947 with the Red Army's victory in Manchuria. There are at least 255 city overprints, thousands of varieties including forgeries.

If you could reexamine the overprint and the cancel, I'm not there but it seems that the overprint may have been applied over a previously canceled stamps. Look it over!

Mike

Thanks Kim :) - Got it again now. It is not pictured in Scott, but it is a semi postal Italian occupation stamp under Yugoslavia as you said. It looks like Italian Air Post stamp Scott #C17 (Type AP6), but with overprint. It would be worth $350 with a cancel on it.

I happily admit I'm more at home with Samvat years than dating in Manchukuo, but I think Manchukuo was using Kang-teh regnal years, not Showa. I would expect that they'd follow the usual practice of year-month-day, rather than day-month-year. So the block of 1 Fen would be dated 20 January Year 5, or 1938 or 1939, depending on whether they were counting inclusively or not.

On the strength of the date (Kang-teh Year 9) on the Fall of Singapore overprint in 1942, it appears they were counting inclusively. So that would give a date for the 1 Fen block of 20 January 1938.

(And just to get things straight, and more confused , Showa assumed the throne in 1926, but because the Japanese count inclusively, it is more convenient to count his regnal years from 1925.)

Which is why one has to be careful about fake cancels on these stamps. $10 mint versus $350 used, too much of a temptation for some.

I once thought collecting used stamps would make my life easier...

Since this is turning into a post on Asian stamps, attached are a couple of Japanese ones which are hiding in Scott somewhere. I assume 1950s or 1960s possibly.

I agree Kim. I have stamps sometimes with cancels on them and the gum is in tact. Kind of makes me wonder...

This thread is starting to get a little confusing. I would suggest that if there are any other posts regarding the Italy/Yugoslavia, it be directed to a new thread. Just my opinion.