Need Help Identifying And Valuing A 1907 2c Washington

Hello!
I have recently become the owner of a large collection of envelopes with a wide variety of stamps and embossed stamps in various denominations and cancellations, from many different locations, etc. I have bought several books to help me identify these and am failing miserably as I can't find the details that I am seeing. Can anyone help me identify these and what their worth might be?

This first is a white (or maybe manilla) envelope from Union National Bank in Eau Claire, WI. The postmark is Eau Claire, WIS. Feb 1, 1907 5 something AM. The embossed stamp is a rectangular orange colored 2 cent Washington with the cancel mostly to the left and a football shaped surcharge I think it is (but I can't make out the amount). There is another cancel with the football shaped mark on the back with the date, no time and no denomination. The envelope is in rough shape and part of the right side was removed - it's quite jagged and shorter than a #10 envelope. The previous owner had it marked as a U385, but the color isn't matching and I can't figure out what the "die" is.

I have attached a couple pictures - hopefully, they will be clear enough - in the hopes that someone can help me identify and maybe estimate the value.

Any assistance would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you,
leeswytz

The scanned image of the embossed stamp is not detailed enough to determine what variety it may be. It is fair to assume that it could very well be a U385. The way to tell is that on the "Two Cents" ribbon there are one short and two long vertical lines to the right of "CENTS".

Assuming it is that variety there are varieties on white, amber, oriental buff, blue and manila colored envelopes. Unfortunately none of the varieties carry a value of much more than $1, most are less (except for the manila variety) and the condition of the cover you have scanned, would suggest that in relatively poor shape it would be worth substantially less than an undamaged cover.

It's still a nice example of an early 20th century cover. They did come in many sized envelopes to suit the particular person or company using them.

The cancel is referred to as a "duplex cancel", which was very common for its day.

Leeswytz,

Firstly welcome to SCF, I'm sure you will find it interesting to hang around here.

You raised a question on an embossed envelope and how to ID it. The best place would be the Scott Specialized US catalog. It has a section on this type of item and with enough information to do the IDing yourself. If you don't have a copy, many public libraries do and if you become serious about US stamps and covers, it will be an invaluable aid.

-Larry

WT1 - Thank you for the information - will need a better magnifier to see the details of the stamp better. My eyes aren't very good and it looks like there are four vertical lines to the right of the "cents" at the bottom. This will sorely test my visual acuity overall.

Larry - Thank you! I have seen the Specialized catalog advertised in many venues, but will have to wait to get one. I'm having a very hard time with the different "dies" as most appear the same to me. Will have to train myself to look at the details more closely.

Thank you both!

leeswytz,

Welcome to the community! The people here are generally knowledgeable, friendly and most are willing to help out when they can. So, keep poking around here and always feel free to ask a question. The only bad question is the one not asked.

Often times you can get an older copy of the Specialized (5-10 years old) on e-bay that won't cost much, under $10.00. The data for that period hasn't changed much, if any so it would still work for what you described in addition to being a great reference book for all the older material.

Possibly this will help: A side-by-side comparison of a U385 and U395 (note the vertical lines that have changed in the banner to the right of "CENTS"):

welcome leeswitz - glad to have you with us!

I also welcome you to SCF. My two cents to this dicussion is that what you have referred to as a surcharge is in fact not a surcharge. It is part of the duplex cancel. What may appear to be a surcharge amount would actually be a number that, for example, identifies which canceling machine applied the cancel.

Hi!
Thanks for all the welcomes - appreciate it greatly!

WT - I finally got a decent close-up of the stamp. Your U395 appears to be closer to what I have. My vertical lines are different though. Yours appear to be stepping up to the upper right, while mine appears to be stepping down to the bottom right and there are no lines to the left of the "TWO CENTS" - ok my eyes are bad as is but I can't see any. Both of yours show lines to the left of the "TWO CENTS".

It is so confusing to know exactly what I am looking for on these so I can tell what is what.

I've attached a close up of this stamp. So, any feedback is greatly appreciated.

Art - I have several books I'd bought and just ordered the specialized yesterday - probably should have gotten that one first. Hopefully I can get some clearer insight to what I have. It's really hard to discern the different dies when my eyes aren't so good and the magnifiers I'm using aren't making things too much clearer.

Your envelope is a 1904 Recut, Scott # U395. The Scott specialized is of little value in regards this issue, as there are over 200 known separately priced die varieties. Whole books have been devoted to this issue, from the 1950s on. Currently, the UPSS catalogs provide the description of the various types and their values. Unfortunately, the descriptions of the types were not included in the latest catalog, but the valuations are on the UPSS website. Click here (http://www.upss.org/code/20thadditions.php ) and there is a link to a PDF for the values. Note the values range to over $100.
The descriptions of the types will be in older versions of the catalog, which may be showing up on ebay as people buy the new edition of the catalog. You may also find the latest book devoted to the issue on ebay, by Fotios Drakos.

There were no manila envelopes for this issue, only manila wrappers.

This issue happens to be a special interest of mine. IDing the various types can be a maddening task, but delightful when you finally nail it.

Hello Thomas,
Thank you for responding with the information and link.

I checked the envelope and found a watermark - apparently it is a watermark 14, 1903-1907. The envelope has a slight fiber pattern that runs very slightly slanted vertically towards the upper right-hand corner and it has very tiny red, blue and black fibers throughout. Need a magnifier to see them.

I am understanding the enthusiasm of others better now, as it sure is laborious finding the details of what we have in front of us. Each envelope has it's own personality and those without the tape of identifying information seem to be appreciated more as I work through the puzzles of them.

They are all watermark 14, except for one wrapper that is unwatermarked.

I see Fotios Drakos' book at other non-eBay places. As low as $9! Pick up a copy and you too can become addicted!

Thomas, You're the man! $9.00

http://www.bonanza.com/booths/Abbys...lopes_Drakos

Art, Thank you! got it on it's merry way!
Thomas, Thank you for the lead & information!