To Trim, Or Not To Trim?

That is the question. Hardly anyone seems to have much interest in cut corners now... and the knowledge base is somewhat limited... daunting.

As some may recall, I was blessed to have inherited a nice collection of cut squares / corners / embossed envelopes etc. complete with certs and some other things.

Unfortunately, this pre-1930 collection is all mounted on acid paper and I need to reconstruct. In doing so, the entire envelopes and postal cards are fairly easy. It's the cut corners which are making me crazy.

All were hinged which, I don't believe, impact anything since there is no gum to disturb. Some are bigger... some are smaller. Some are front and back of the "cut envelope" some aren't. Can I, Dare I, trim the larger sized ones for uniformity to remount in showguard... do I trim the back off? Obviously, we don't trim down to the oval ... but what is an accepted standard.

There is just so much one can do for a labor of love. And this is the winter project.

Thanks much... B

I don't know if there really is a set 'standard' anymore. Cut squares WAS the precedent, but with the advent of the MNH popularity, entires sort of took over. I don't think that end of collecting has ever been as wide as the 'stamp' end of things, and I've not heard of any major swing one way or the other. So far as cut squares, I've always understood those to simply be the 'front' section, so there's likely no real reason to not trim the backs off of those that have them.

That being said, were it me, I wouldn't trim anything any further, but I doubt it would really make much difference, given you just want a uniform look. Guess it's pretty much personal preference.

Don't trim anything. Larger corners and full corners (those with the back of the envelope included) are worth more (often much more) than close cut corners. Especially on the scarcer items. Uniformity of size is not the point of collecting, enjoying what you have and completeness in this area are (usually) the reasons. Complete cancels on used corners also make them more interesting. If you feel the different sizes make it difficult to mount in an album, think about getting a couple of good stockbooks and mount the collection in those. Obviously you own them and you can do what you want, but trimming them is usually a bad idea.

Hi, nice to see you back at it!

To me, I like to see as much of a cut corner or envelope now as possible.

The ones I encounter in kiloware at times, or lots of stamps or mixtures, are always interesting, more with cancels, complete as mentioned above, or even with other information on the envelope or postcard, such as writing or printed info.

The paper is an interesting thing also, it's colour, the bigger swatch of paper to look at the better.

There are clear on both sidea Vario papges to use for storing things you wish to see the front and back of.

Standards change with time. As what was once common to do is now the wrong way to do it. However in the end they are yours and as long as they are not valuable then fell free to do it the way you want to.

While I am not old enough to remember the days mint stamps were pasted in albums and I did start with neatly trimmed squares. Thus my first collection are all trimmed. Today I do not trim anything and if possible search for the entire cover.

I don't mount mine but have them in a stock book, which works for me. I treat the entire envelop just like any other cover. Remember when you cut you can not add it back on. We are in this hobby to collect stamps, not to agonize over how to collect them and how to separate them.

With that said I go buy this unofficial rule for everything.

There are rules of do and don't in stamp collecting, and often the don'ts are more important than the dos. By now most collectors know not to cut a stamp off an envelope until it is determined that the envelope or cover is not more valuable than would be the stamp alone. This would include trimming and cut squares / corners / embossed envelopes etc.

Without even reading the above I can tell you that you should not trim anything! Sometimes it's the paper or postmark that contain the pieces history/story and if you remove it them obviously you ruin any potential way of extracting it's story or importance. Cut-corners are usually passed over by collectors to complete examples.

mkfarm: I love your comment about collecting and not agonizing about how to do it!
I sometimes "agonize" because there are so many "rules" about collecting correctly.
Recently I was told that used/cancelled Washington/Franklins don't get watermarked (why bother!), but used is what I have and I would like to place them in the correct spot, so...
I have close trimmed cut squares from years ago, but now I keep the whole item for the reasons mentioned previously.
Once again I am reminded that my collection is MINE and if it makes my happy that's all that matters.
So, if these items were mine I would keep the whole item and figure out how to store the items.

I always prefer the entire cover- so sad to see the corners trimmed down to the very border sometimes. I use acid free, non-adhesive photo album pages to house my collections- a little cheaper than stock book pages and easy to view.

I don't want to be a "Negative Nancy" here but may I just say a few suggestions for your consideration?

Look I agree that doing it your way is the whole point but on that same token, why do more more damage to an old philatelic item?

lastly,I would seriously re-think the photo album storage. It may just end up ruining your collection.

While I agree with the principle that doing it your way is a big part of stamp collecting, that is a dictum that applies specifically to the way you choose to arrange your collection. That does not apply to conservation, that is, how you care for the preservation of your material. How you treat your stamps has a lasting effect on them that carries on after they have left your possession. Years ago serious philatelists began to see themselves as custodians of their material, with less claim to outright ownership. As historical and cultural artifacts, stamps of a given country are a part of its cultural heritage. As philatelists we seek to preserve and interpret that heritage for a variety of reasons. But learning and developing the skills for keeping stamps safe is part of the role as a true philatelist.

When it comes to deciding what to collect, how to arrange it, how to show it to others, and so on, it's all about you.

But when it comes to understanding the material as artifact, learning about its history, and keeping it safe from destruction or deterioration, it's not all about you.

Here's a practical point you probably aren't aware of: when you go to a show you expect the dealers to show you material you would like to get. But far more dealers than you realize will size you up as a collector and only show you what they think you can properly handle. And that's not always just about money. The dealers are pros and for the sake of their livelihood keep an eye out for the hobby. Think about it.

Final note: as a matter of cultivating habit, whoever is faithful in little things, will be faithful in big things.

You know I just like to collect stamps for my own reasons. When it comes to old or high value stamps then they should be protected as best you can. However the vast majority of stamps are both common and plentiful. People use these stamps for many things such as art work where they are cut and glued to whatever.

Now when some one is going to judge or limit my ability to collect what I want they have gone way to far and IMHO become unfair gatekeepers that we do not need. Who are they to select who should and should not have a particular stamp. They make the hobby snobbish.

If you want to protect a stamp then buy it and care for it the way you feel it should be done. However while I may or may not agree with how a person takes care of a stamp they own it and it is their choice.

Don't get me wrong I know we are in agreement for the safe keeping of stamps. However I will always fight anyone that has a higher than great feeling and would limited anyone's ability to posses a stamp based on what they feel is right or wrong about that person.

Stamp handling has changed over the past 100 years and it will change over the next 100 years.

I do believe it is wise to give suggestion to anyone on how to properly take care of stamps. But to restrict people or believe only your standards can apply to this hobby is not what we need. It will in fact limit the hobby in the long term.

For the record I treat every classic stamp damaged, great condition or what ever as a national treasure but that is my choice. I have stock books upon stock books of many of the common classics just because I know I will keep them safe. But that is my choice I would imagine most people would destroy the damaged or hand off all the duplicates.

Many people frown about the 'Antique Roadshow Syndrome' where the advice is always 'don't touch/restore our item' since it will surely decease value. While this is undoubtedly true with small percentage of museum quality/rare items it often makes much more sense to tell the person to enjoy their procession. If enjoying it and using it means that it is restored, go for it.

Ditto with many old cars. The vast majority of older cars are better off being put back on the road and enjoyed; it makes little financial sense to turn them into a museum pieces. I bought the car in my avatar from the original owner after it was stored for decades while he was overseas. It was as original as a mid-50s car could be, nothing had been touched. But it still was a 4 door sedan, Studebaker made 250,000+ of them. I did not do a frame off restoration, I did not haul the car around in a car carrier. I restored it and my wife and I drove it for years; not only did we get a huge amount of great memories but we also promoted the hobby and our national Studebaker Drivers Club.

I feel the same about philatelic items; unless the items are rare folks should enjoy them as they see fit. Obviously good conservation guidelines should be followed as best you can but I see no issue with trimming off small amounts of cut squares to make them more uniform or to fit in a mount. I would be considerate of cancelations, decent margins, and I would leave any backs alone.

I often wonder how long people think paper will survive even when mounted on acid free pages or in mounts. Why would acid free album page matter if a collector leaves a stamp on an untreated old envelope? Many old envelopes were made with cheaper wood pulp and have large amounts of acid in them yet I see very little in the philatelic press on how to preserve/neutralize them.

Back in the 1970s I was given a very large amount of 19th century stamps still on paper. I floated about half of them (several thousand) but left the rest until this year. When I compare the ones left on paper with the ones that I floated the amount of toning and other acidification issue on those still on the old envelopes was pretty shocking to me; I wish I had soaked them all back in the 70s.

Does anyone know if the US Postal Service used acid free envelopes for all their stationary? If not, how does one prevent toning and other issues with acid paper?

I don't feel you are being fair in drawing the implication from my remarks that somehow I am so naïve as to believe only "my" standards apply to this hobby. Where are you getting that?

You said we agreed on the importance of understanding good conservation techniques, and you stressed that you impose that on yourself. The only other area I mentioned was arrangement, and for that I emphasized that the field is wide open.

So what are these "restrictive standards" I am being taken to task for?

No disrespect but it is more than implied in your entire writing of your post. You certainly added a few points such as custodial over ownership and the last part of your post is pretty clear.

Nothing personal and no personal attacks on you. Just a clear difference in how I look at the hobby and collector than you do.

Just a simple disagreement and if you did not mean to imply anything then maybe my pro property rights side of me worked a little over time.

Other than that you are more than free to have that opinion, doesn't make you a bad guy.

Not certain how you got idea of "photo album storage"... from acid free pages and showguard mounts in a Scott binder... Caption replicated to the original. Just looking to make it a slightly more polished look. I know about removing cancel marks, so the trimming question goes to something like more uniform sizing on this page of "booby heads".

To the conversation about "conservation"... when I first began this journey with the folk of SCF I knew zip about zingle. Had I sold my collection to the first "dealer" who skimmed thru my binders, saw a novice and offered me 600 for the lot... I'd be out a bundle. I'll not ever have enough value to "retire" on, but it may help with a dinner out or taxes down the road.

But you can only get something for what is offered for sale... and since I was unwilling to sell, without knowing what I had... I started scanning.

I will have/ now have / the basis for a "virtual" collection and it's pristine, (as long as I keep updating the software to make it viable for the next generation or two.) What they choose to do with either that, or what I do with the real, is the reason I'm currently conserving both. Let's face it, by mid 2050, if not well before, The whole idea of snail mail will be obsolete in even "3rd world countries" and stamps, stamp makers and what we do will have passed into oblivion.

The real question is which is more likely to create an interest when rediscovered... the real, or virtual. Gee... SPOCK... where are you?