Need Help With A 1 C Franklin

Need help with a 1c franklin. I attached a very poor photo. I also included so you could see the color. This stamp I can't find the color. It's a grey green so I attached a blue, green and grey to see.

I do believe it has the secret mark (the dash) in the circle over the E in "one" along the bottom. The circles at the top are also colored in.
It is attached to a piece of paper, which I attached a photo. It's on the back of a bank check written out on July 16, 188? either a 1 or a 7

I know this is real because it came in large boxes from a 95 year old who passed and I have found fractional currency and a ton of other old stamps.

Some of these say with GRILL I am a newbie but I don't think there are grills.

Scott # 206

206...for sure

that's what I though thanks a ton

so it was never used or canceled but it is stuck to the paper, is it consider a used stamp then??

This is an interesting item, so long as it remains on the check. It is a 206, redesigned issue as noted, but the earliest documented postal use for this design is Oct 11, 1881, with confirmed production by August 1881. The style of the impression and the color both suggest the 1887 date, but you might want to have a revenue expert look at the date on the check to be sure. The chances of it being an early example of the redesigned 1c are slim, but I would leave no stone unturned. Any revenue cancels/handstamps on it?

the stamps looks brand new except it is stuck to the paper also the left hand side looks like it was cut with a scissors with a mag. glass I can see only I few places where the perfs were, it was a close cut. I guess the color to me seems off. but I am and need to get like a PMS color book

If you need a PMS guide for other things, then by all means. But for stamps it won't help you. The color nomenclature in the hobby does not correspond with color names in the world of art. There are color guides for US stamps, and different ones for Great Britain and its former colonies. Then there's the rest of the world. Each country will have its own standard, so guides are of limited usefulness. It's better to make up your own guide with stamps as you get to know them.

The straight edge you see may have come from scissors, but the stamps along the center column of a two-pane (right/left) plate have a natural cut line where the panes were separated in manufacture. The stamps there have a straight edge either right or left.

The tool you need the most at this stage is a standard catalog for US stamps. Let me suggest that you buy a used one, out of date, to learn how to identify material, along with a simpler price-list type of book for current values. US stamps are all keyed with identification numbers that are pretty much standard for all lists. The key is a tool called the Scott Specialized (Catalogue of United States Stamps & Covers). Search in ebay on the first two words for an edition you can afford and go for it. Be prepared, the current one would cost you $75-100, and it will be replaced in November. But the Specialized will teach you the color names in use for all US stamps, along with a host of other details. Use its indices as a kind of classroom and you will shorten the learning curve considerably. Try not to buy one more than 5 years old, and don't pay much for one of those either. It might even be that someone on the list has a spare, or that you could get a loaner at the library or a stamp club in your area (if you can find one).

Although the check tax was still in force in 1881, it was not by 1887. The bigger problem is that there was no one cent rate. The tax was 2 cents for checks, and by 1875 the stamps were usually (but not always) put on the front. Mostly because it was only one stamp, and after 1871 two cents was the only face value adhesive issued. Much more likely that this stamp simply got stuck on the document at some point.

Yes, there are several unknowns operating here. We don't know when the stamp was affixed to the check or why it is on the back. We don't know what may or may not have been attached to the half we don't have. We don't know if there are additional markings that haven't been noticed just yet. But, for the moment, it's best to leave things unaltered on the stamp and check until the unknowns are cleared up. That's pretty much where I'm coming from in my recommendations. For all I know some 5 year old in 1902 got ahold of some loose old stamps and stuck a couple on odd pieces of paper. It could be anything.

Hi, Diane... with all due respect to
the previous posters, I don't see enough
there for (anyone) to definitely state
it's a 206... it could just as easily be
either a 145, 156 or 182... there's simply
not ample imagery there (and color) to
definitely state it's positively any one
of the 4 possibilites...

As a note, though... if you're certain
your stamp has the secret mark, it would
make it either a 156 (A44a), or (possibly)
a re-engraved 206 (A144b) *if* and *only-if*
the secret mark was carried over to the 206,
(the available information on this point is
'implied' but not clearly stated)... (which)
coupled with the color ~ *if* it is Gray Blue,
would make it a 206...


Randall

Without manipulating anything,
other than cropping and enlarging
400% here's your stamp exactly as
you uploaded it... (of course there
does not exist enough pixels for
any clarity), but the color is the
same...

Could be an illegal usage as a revenue paid in a pinch but like you stated who know when they was affixed. if it is a legitimate illegal usage it could be an early usage of that issue! neat!

Diane,

Please do not be confused by Randall's comments. To those of us who really KNOW these issues, the identity of that 1c is as clear as the commems you have around it. Let me explain why.

In 1881 the American Bank Note Co. had determined to stay with soft paper, and they did not like the way the original designs of certain stamps reproduced on that paper. In the case of the 1c stamps they re-engraved the original die, and made numerous changes to the style of engraving, not just in a few marks. In particular they used acid to etch the background shading lines in places and so deepen them. These pics are from die proofs. On the left, the design as it was being used up to 1881, and on the right is the revised design.




Notice how the design on the left has a lighter, more open feeling to the background shading, especially in the upper half? Notice that in the figure on the right the upper arabesque figures now have marks of shading in them, lending a darker feel to the top of the design? These differences are very noticeable at a glance when you have a lot of experience with them, and you don't need detailed inspection to show them. Now, let me ask you, if we call the design on the left "156" and the design on the right "206," which of these is more similar to the design of the stamp you have on that partial check?

essayk, I had just recently spent time on this over at Bill Weiss' web site. You explain it very well. Also, having the proofs side by side like you presented above, is really nice.

i do know I have a lot to learn.

thanks for the advice on the book to buy, I found this one on Amazon Scott Specialized Catalogue of United States Stamps & Covers 2011 (Paperback)

so I will start there. I have been using a USPS guide to stamps 2012, but not all stamps and colors are listed with a photo. I hope this helps me out a lot.

but I do have to say it's been kinda exciting to see if I have something special. (My luck is never, but it's fun)

thank you Essayk for that. I do think I have a 206. it must be a slight off color, it's has blue but I wouldn't discribe it as that, more of a grayish color but on the blue side vs the green. anyways it was fun thinking I might have had something.

my inherated collection is 6,000 stamps touched and looked at and about 20,000 left to look at.

so one more quick question, ok 2.

i have a lot of stamps that were afixed to envelope but the envelope never used and most of the stamps are still attached but torn from the full envelope maybe to save on room..


also I have a few set of unsed stamps, old one but since they sat on top of each other and afert years of mositure they now are sticking to each other, what do I do with them?? seperace or is there a secert?