Stamp Community Family of Web Sites
Thousands of stamps, consistently graded, competitively priced and hundreds of in-depth blog posts to read
Stamp Community Forum
 
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

Welcome Guest! Need help? Got a question? Inherit some stamps?
Our stamp forum is completely free! Register Now!

Chalky Paper

 
To participate in the forum you must log in or register.
Author Previous TopicReplies: 13 / Views: 5,998Next Topic  
Pillar Of The Community
USA
2492 Posts
Posted 04/23/2014   7:52 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add modern_who to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
In cataloging some old King George V stamps from St. Helena, today, I once again faced the chalky paper dilemma.

Trying to find some help beyond the Scott Catalogs, I did on online search and was happy to see that Wikipedia had it covered, until I read the following:


Quote:
Chalky paper is a philatelic term for a type of paper coated with a chalky solution for security purposes.[1] The postmark cannot be removed without damaging the surface of the stamp[2] thus discouraging erasure of cancellations and fraudulent reuse of stamps. The paper was first coated with a chalk-like powder, and the ink for the stamp was then impressed upon the paper. Collectors are cautioned not to attempt to remove a stamp printed on chalky paper from an envelope or paper backer by soaking it in fluid, as this may destroy the stamp's design. A simple test for chalky paper is to rub a silver coin over it, resulting in a "pencil" type mark.[2]


Rub a silver coin over it to get a "pencil" type mark!

Yes, and shoot yourself in the foot to see if the gun is loaded.

But then, I suppose if you can't tell whether or not a stamp is on chalky paper by looking at it, it probably isn't.
Send note to Staff
Larry, APS Member

Modern-Vue Stamps on eBay

Valued Member
United States
95 Posts
Posted 04/24/2014   01:07 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Chewie to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
gotta love wiki
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United Kingdom
1187 Posts
Posted 04/24/2014   02:37 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Terence Collins to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi modern_who,

Get them off paper with Stamplift fluid applied lightly to the back of the paper with a soft watercolour brush. Do not let the fluid touch the face of the stamp. Do not saturate or soak the piece in it. Works every time for me.

Terry
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United States
1947 Posts
Posted 04/24/2014   06:10 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rohumpy to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Chalky paper gets a little tricky especially with the KEVII and KGV issues of Britain. I have found that the detection of chalky paper works for the most part by tilting the stamp toward a light source and observing a shiny surface. However there is the Dickinson coated paper of the 6d King George V which Stanley Gibbons specifically states that it does not respond to the silver test. I have one of these stamps, but have relied on the expertise of the seller (Arthur Ryan & co. of London)
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United States
1333 Posts
Posted 04/24/2014   09:39 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Trainwreck to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I have to look at the stamps under a microscope. Besides the overall shininess, some of the things I look for:
1. Sometimes you can see the top layer of chalk around the perforation holes. The chalk breaks off unevenly around the holes.
2. The ink does not soak into the stamp like it does with uncoated paper. I found this an especially useful observation with the pre-WWI Austrian definitive series.
3. Generally, you can't see the paper fibers.
4. The chalk surface may exhibit micro-cracks.

Regards, Robert
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
USA
2492 Posts
Posted 04/25/2014   08:00 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add modern_who to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thank you, all, for your comments.

I will try doing what you have to say, rohumpy and Robert.

On first reading, I didn't know what your reply had to do with anything, Terry, but soon realized that's how you remove them from paper to keep the image from floating off the chalky coating.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Larry, APS Member

Modern-Vue Stamps on eBay
Pillar Of The Community
Netherlands
943 Posts
Posted 04/26/2014   1:21 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Galeoptix to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Usually you can tell by looking at the surface!

Often the surface shows a moon crater landscape!

Stamps of the Federated Malay States issued in 1907 had been printed in typography on coated paper - chalky paper as the English used to say - that shows exactly the same type of pockmarks as the Argentine stamps on coated Zárate paper in the period 1966-1967:





Or take Argentina:








Or even German Democratic Republic:




Coated papers are everywhere!

And the silver test even works for the back of the stamp!











Of the 3 stamps only the utmost right stamp had a coating!






Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Valued Member
Canada
222 Posts
Posted 04/26/2014   2:15 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add luvthecommonwealth to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
One of my Hong Kong stamps had a small line from where someone had tested some sort of silver against it to see if it was chalky. I was able to get rid of by gently erasing with a white staedtler eraser. I've used the same eraser to erase pencil prices and other things on covers and album pages at times.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United States
1333 Posts
Posted 04/26/2014   2:38 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Trainwreck to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
gently erasing with a white staedtler eraser.

Staedtler erasers are great. They will completely remove pencil marks (I use them to remove light dirt spots too). Too bad they can't remove the pencil indentation in the paper. Oh well.

Regards, Robert
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
USA
2492 Posts
Posted 04/26/2014   6:32 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add modern_who to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Good information, Galeoptix. I take it you did this by enlarging scans and these were not photographed through a magnifier, correct?

Great if the silver coin works on the back as well. Looking farther, someone posted a comment on another website I found that the mark left by a silver coin was tarnish, but your example seems to disprove that theory.

As for the the St. Helena stamps I have, they are MNH, so it won't work on them.

As for the Steadtler erasers, I have used them for years. My mother drew schematics (drafting). While the Steadtler's are expensive, if you know what you are looking for it's possible to find similar plastic erasers at a dollar store. I picked up a three pack for a buck, a few years ago.

Here's what I had to say about erasers back in 2008 at the following thread.

http://goscf.com/t/3268&SearchTerms=eraser


Quote:
I never use the old style pink eraser, especially the
ones on the tops of pencils because they dry out and
can smudge. I only use old type cleaner that came in a
purple block and could be kneaded or the more recent
white plastic erasers, used in drafting, that will do
a very clean job. I erase a lot of things from covers
and haven't had a problem, yet. The type cleaner was
for cleaning the keys of the old-style inked ribbon
typewriters, so try to find some now. It seems to work
by pulling things into itself and leaves no crumbs.
Lately I've preferred the Steadtler Mars white plastic
eraser, and have listed a couple of links. It's used
widely by draftsman, so should also be available locally
at any art or drafting supply store. You might try it
by lightly marking up some envelopes as you might find
marked by a collector. I generally don't rub in both
directions, but only away from myself.

http://cgi.ebay.com/2-Staedtler-Mar...aultDomain_0

http://cgi.ebay.com/STAEDTLER-Mars-..._Accessories


Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Larry, APS Member

Modern-Vue Stamps on eBay
Pillar Of The Community
United States
1947 Posts
Posted 04/27/2014   06:30 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rohumpy to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Can someone further elaborate on the silver point test on the backs of stamps. I was not aware that the chalk surfaced paper included both sides of the paper. Is this true for all chalk surfaced paper or only some issues?

I have not observed the shininess of the surface of the paper on the reverse sides of the stamp. the reverse usually looks somewhat rough and porous on the British issues of the early 20th century.

The "other" forum has an informative thread on chalky paper. One poster suggests that long wave UV light is helpful, in that the chalky paper appears whiter. This seems to me to be somewhat relative.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Edited by rohumpy - 04/27/2014 06:41 am
Pillar Of The Community
Netherlands
943 Posts
Posted 04/27/2014   09:35 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Galeoptix to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply


Rohumpy,

Two of my stamps were NOT EVEN coated let alone had a CHALKY surface!!

The only reliable way - apart from chemical experiments of which the silver test is one and causes harm to your stamps! - is to see whether the surface is SHINY and has a moon crater appearance!

The chalky paper business is a hoax and can hardly be established by anyone without years of experience! The experts that say they can guarantee are to be believed on their Judy blue eyes....

groetjes, Rein
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United States
1947 Posts
Posted 04/28/2014   06:38 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rohumpy to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I cant agree with you, galeoptix, that the chalky paper business is a hoax. If you place a chalk surfaced stamp next to the same issue on ordinary paper and tilt both against a light source, the difference is obvious. It does not require a stretch of the imagination to see it.

I would guess that some issues are more difficult to determine than others, but the early 20th century British issues are obvious.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Edited by rohumpy - 04/28/2014 06:39 am
Pillar Of The Community
Netherlands
943 Posts
Posted 04/28/2014   06:46 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Galeoptix to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Rohumpy,

it is the chalk issue that upsets me, not the coatings that had been applied...

You can have coated paper stamps - Straits Settlements, Malayan states or there about - which the UK collectors refuse to call chalky! The term "surrogate" gets used...

groetjes, Rein
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
  Previous TopicReplies: 13 / Views: 5,998Next Topic  
 
To participate in the forum you must log in or register.


Go to Top of Page
Disclaimer: While a tremendous amount of effort goes into ensuring the accuracy of the information contained in this site, Stamp Community assumes no liability for errors. Copyright 2005 - 2020 Stamp Community Family - All rights reserved worldwide. Use of any images or content on this website without prior written permission of Stamp Community or the original lender is strictly prohibited.
Privacy Policy / Terms of Use    Advertise Here
Stamp Community Forum © 2007 - 2020 Stamp Community Forums
It took 0.78 seconds to lick this stamp. Powered By: Snitz Forums 2000 Version 3.4.05