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China Red Revenue #84 Counterfeit?

 
 
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United States
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Posted 04/19/2019   11:32 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add NanoPhilatelic to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
Is this a genuine China Red Revenue 84? PSE sent me back a cert saying it was counterfeit. But I think it is genuine. Notice the small red specks on the front and back it would be impossible to recreate those.
Any thoughts?
For the record, I love PSE, I am nothing but please with their service and will be using their services again. I am only asking for feedback.

Thank you.


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Posted 04/20/2019   12:21 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add redwoodrandy to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
A certified copy.



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Posted 04/20/2019   12:22 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add DrewM to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
You haven't told us what made PSE decide it was a counterfeit. Don't they tell you on the certificate? To my untrained eye, that is one very nice looking stamp in nearly new condition, a factor that makes it ether a very high quality genuine stamp -- or suspect as a reprint or counterfeit, meaning a stamp can look "too good". It's a pretty good counterfeit, if it is one.

Now I see the certificate for the genuine stamp. Any chance of seeing the certificate for the one in question?

Here are a few differences I see:
The characters on your copy are much darker and more intense than on the legitimate copy which has more lightly inked characters.

In "dollar," the upper "flags" on the two "l's on the genuine copy are longer than on the other version where they seem shorter and stubbier.

The thickness and direction of some of the lines of the Chinese characters vary from one version to another.

The upper leftmost Chinese character is very different from one stamp to another. Look particularly at the horizontal cross bar which seems to be missing from the genuine stamp.

And so on.
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Edited by DrewM - 04/20/2019 12:34 am
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Posted 04/20/2019   12:35 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add redwoodrandy to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Just look at the engraving. A stamp to behold in person. The "red revenues."
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Posted 04/20/2019   12:40 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add hy-brasil to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
NanoPhilatelic, is the color of yours accurately reproduced on your screen? What I see is an incorrect color for the stamp. There really are no shades for this issue. Compare with redwoodrandy's.

Is the underlying stamp engraved? It does not appear to be in the blowup. The engine turning in the genuine around "3 CENTS" is very clear and finely done in the genuine. Again, compare with redwoodrandy's. And this stamp cannot be made from an original red revenue (without overprint) as that is far rarer than a large one dollar surcharge.
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Edited by hy-brasil - 04/20/2019 12:50 am
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Posted 04/20/2019   01:51 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add NanoPhilatelic to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
They never gave me a reason why they thought it was counterfeit. I asked, to no avail. I would really like to know.
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Posted 04/20/2019   01:56 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add NanoPhilatelic to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Here is the cert. I got back.

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Posted 04/20/2019   02:00 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add NanoPhilatelic to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Here is a closer scan of the stamp.



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Posted 04/20/2019   02:02 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add NanoPhilatelic to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
redwoodrandy I see the same tiny red specks on yours that I do mine.

The overprint characters are not that intense, and in some spots transparent.
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Edited by NanoPhilatelic - 04/20/2019 02:04 am
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Posted 04/20/2019   07:19 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add perf12 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
What the expertizers saw first was that the base stamp is a forgery.
In the genuine stamps the cross hatching in the center is close knit.


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Edited by perf12 - 04/20/2019 10:24 am
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Posted 04/20/2019   10:23 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add StateRevs to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Disclaimer - I know little to nothing about these stamps.

That said, and ignoring the printing, to my eye the perfs on NanoPhilatelic's copy look completely different than redwoodrandy's.

NanoPhilatelic's look too perfect and the hole size looks to be smaller? May just be from the different sized scans?
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Posted 04/20/2019   11:08 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add NanoPhilatelic to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
My perfs look inconsistent. I will upload a picture with the perf. gauge a little later. I should of done earlier.
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Posted 04/20/2019   11:54 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Partime to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I do not have the $1.00 version, but I do have the one cent. It is NOT a certified copy, but here is a closeup of the inner circle. The cross hatching is shown in higher detail for your consideration.
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