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Romania : Detecting Forgeries.

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Bedrock Of The Community
Australia
38679 Posts
Posted 08/29/2012   04:10 am  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add rod222 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
Has anyone a 5p Prince Cuza 1865 stamp (GENUINE)
that they would care to share here please?
Preferably 600dpi.
I need a comparison for my stamps which I believe to be forgeries.
I have the info from Romanian stamps.com
but would like an in-your-face example of a genuine.

Thanks:
Here is more supposed forgery
1. dodgy pmk

Correction
2. dot under S of posta (appear on genuine stamp)
3. large top to "R" of FRANCO (appear on genuine stamp)

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Edited by rod222 - 08/29/2012 07:04 am

Pillar Of The Community
Romania
886 Posts
Posted 08/29/2012   05:42 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Wadmalatz to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply


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Pillar Of The Community
Romania
886 Posts
Posted 08/29/2012   05:53 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Wadmalatz to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The number of diamonds under FRANCO and POSTA seems all right.
Under FRANCO the number of diamonds (rhombus) in a row= 13, there is a forgery with only 9 1/2 diamonds/row.
Under POSTA (left) or ROMANA (right)- 12 diamonds in a row, one type of forgery: 11 or 11 1/2 diamonds.
The dot under S is characteristic for the design, as on the picture. Yours seem to be all right, presenting many of the characteristics (for example nr. 12 on the right)- edit: or it is a really elaborate forgery.



Rod, I have two Romanian catalogues I would recommend, if there`s a possibility to get them. (unfortunately in Romania only a few detailed stamp catalogues were issued)
First is black&white (the picture is from that one) and it`s from 1974 (!), wasn`t followed by another one (as far as I know) till 2006 ! (32 years)
`CATALOGUL MARCILOR POSTALE ROMANESTI` by Kiriac Dragomir, 1974
`CATALOGUL TIMBRELOR POSTALE ROMANESTI`by Manole Mircea, 2006 (first volume dealing 1858-1947 issues, with pretty goog BOB section)- coloured, although the pictures presenting design characteristics of the stamps didn`t changed.
-edit: it seems, that there was another (probably) re-issue in 1984, sold on ebay for 32 USD:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/CATALOGUL-M...cmd=ViewItem
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Edited by Wadmalatz - 08/29/2012 06:30 am
Pillar Of The Community
United States
8397 Posts
Posted 08/29/2012   06:48 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add floortrader to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I'll try to post later today .im off to work but think I can post a scan which would be helpful.
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Bedrock Of The Community
Australia
38679 Posts
Posted 08/29/2012   07:10 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks very much guys, that is a real surprise
so I may have a genuine, I didn't pay much for it
so that is very pleasing.
Thanks for you tremendous assistance, I can use this as a template for others.

22crows suggested politely I may have been reading
the Romaniastamps.com page incorrectly
I think she is right.
:(
Wadmalatz,
Do you think the catalogue would be helpful, being as I cannot read Romanian?

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Pillar Of The Community
Romania
886 Posts
Posted 08/29/2012   07:23 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Wadmalatz to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The catalogues mentioned are containing the design characteristics, these could be useful. Still I`d only recommend if the price+shipping cost is affordable, as especially the first ones (1974, 1984) contain lot of textual description....
-simple `grill` postmark, these were ordered from France. Variable dimensions: -larger ones: 34/16 mm, used mainly by larger post-offices (those offering telegraph services too)
- smaller: 30/14 mm (early date 07.02.1865, late date 1906)
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Edited by Wadmalatz - 08/29/2012 07:29 am
Bedrock Of The Community
Australia
38679 Posts
Posted 08/29/2012   09:01 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thank you,
I think the value of my collection demands I secure one.

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Bedrock Of The Community
Australia
38679 Posts
Posted 08/29/2012   9:24 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Rooting out the nefarious...

Someone on SCF once wondered why people collect Forgeries,
this little varlet was on an album paged marked "thin $47.50"

It's rather obvious but the LHS is the genuine article (I think)
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Bedrock Of The Community
Australia
38679 Posts
Posted 08/29/2012   9:38 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Romania Postage due...ID please.
Green and gold

I have joined the Romanian specialists forum
but have to wait to see if I pass muster.


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Bedrock Of The Community
Australia
38679 Posts
Posted 08/29/2012   9:56 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
There's a cat here for $39 US
How do you see this price?
http://www.okazii.ro/accesorii-efec...a--a59298548
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Pillar Of The Community
Romania
886 Posts
Posted 08/30/2012   06:15 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Wadmalatz to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Taxa de Plata, (yellowish)green/emerald several issues bw. 1887-1902 (6 issues), unfortunately usually the paper type used makes the difference (white, yellowish, oily??, pinkish etc.). Howewer this has a bit darker colour then the first two issues (1887-1888). Does it have wmk(PR or small coat of arm)? The 1890 issue was printed on oil(y)-paper too (whatever that would mean and it has wmk (small coat of arm). First two issues (1887-1888) are without wmk.
I`d say this is an 1890 issue with small coat of arm wmk, and the paper absorbed inking...(I know that in Hungary during the printing process of the Envelope types the plates were wiped with an oily substance and if this remained on plates resulted in an impression that was strongly visible on the backside too)
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Bedrock Of The Community
Australia
38679 Posts
Posted 08/30/2012   06:32 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Bang on Wadmalatz,
small crown (nice wmk too)
Yellowish paper for mine,
but I really wouldn't know any difference.
These are not listed in any Gibbons catalogue I have.
Thanks.

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Pillar Of The Community
Romania
886 Posts
Posted 08/30/2012   06:46 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Wadmalatz to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The Catalogue is a 2010-2011 version of the 2006 Catalogue I use. This deals only with 1858-1947 issues, the stamp discussed is listed there. As for the price I cannot comment (mine was inherited), but it weights cca. 600 gram., it has 328 pages
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Bedrock Of The Community
Australia
38679 Posts
Posted 08/30/2012   09:53 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Identifying a 20pa Forgery (Right)

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Pillar Of The Community
United States
7070 Posts
Posted 08/30/2012   10:47 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Cjd to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Rod, Scott lists your postage due. I'm surprised it isn't tucked in SG somewhere, but who knows?

The 1887, J11, is gray-green; the 1888, J16, is green on yellowish paper; the 1890, J20, is emerald; the 1898, J26, is blue green; the 1902, J32, is green on thin paper, tinted rose on back; the 1908, J38, is green on white paper. The 1890 and 1898 issues are watermarked.

I'm not going to be any help picking a likely candidate (unless you find a watermark).

I know the Scott numbers don't help you, per se, but maybe you can use them with Google to find more.
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Pillar Of The Community
Romania
886 Posts
Posted 08/30/2012   11:37 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Wadmalatz to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Identifying a 20pa Forgery (Right)

And a rudimentary one! `DOUA PARALE` instead of `DOUA DECI PARALE`.
And the frames of the boxes with the denomination seem to be `borrowed` from the 5 parale denomination. Maybe this is a contemporary forgery to trick the post??
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