A Couple New (To Me) Large Queen Varieties 12 1/2 & 15c

Picked up these 4 large queens for just over $12 . Wasn't expecting much as pics were not good and there were obvious faults but can't help myself with these. To my surprise the 12.5 is missing left frame line and the 15c I am sure I am seeing the S of the bothwell watermark. Just never know what surprises are out there.
Anyone with a duckworth catalog-- Is there mention of extended right side #1 on the 12.5c ? Can't tell if its damage but looks like the right side 1 extends up into the framework.

Nice purchase! I love the large queens also.

The extended "1" looks like a paper scratch/damage. Check with x10 magnifier, it should show if it is damage.

But yes, I see the "S" - congrats!

Is that vertical wove paper on the back of the stamp?

Jogil- I believe you may be correct as it doesn't have the tell tale diamond pattern from regular bothwell paper. I was so wrapped up in seeing the S I didn't give it much thought. Now I'm even more confused because I don't believe Bothwell did a vertical wove with watermark. I have no fluid to properly test so I am relying on color/contrast adjustments but there sure seems to be an S there. Any ideas??

I thought all Bothwell paper was vertical wove (albeit with a strong diamond pattern).

yes but not really seeing the diamond or diagonal mesh lines. Still pretty sure it is the S by size and looks but the lack of other features has me confused. Here are the 15 and 6c backs with no alterations. The 6c (right side)looks horizontal wove but stronger mesh pattern.

nitrolures...I am no expert on papers, so I used my program to bring out the texture more..Does it look horizontally wove design..<<<<<<i mean in the direction of my arrows..???

I think the only way to know for sure is to get some watermark fluid. Or, since it is used, you could just put it in water.

wert, yes that is the direction, but it is vertical.

NO...I see it as horizontal...In my personal opinion...

What is interesting about these stamps is that sometimes you can spot vertical wove paper on them, especially on some ebay listings where it shows the back of the stamp and the person selling it didn't notice it. Is vertical wove paper rarer than horizontal wove paper?

On large queens, vertical wove is less common.

But....BUT, is not his stamp horizontal wove...????

The 12.5 cent looks right but I suggest you soak off paper adhesions on front. The 15 cent is vertical wove but I think a later printing and not Bothwell paper, may I suggest you check it in watermark fluid. If good, the S must show reversed (S of MILLS) to make any sense.

wert, your arrows are up and down (vertical wove). The program you used compressed the stamp so that it looks squat. It is still up and down though, and so vertical (stamp and wove).

3Dadeo...Let me set you straight...i have the stamp on its side..My program is correct...