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Printing Album Pages - Dye Vs. Pigment Ink

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Posted 09/19/2014   2:20 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add apastuszak to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
I print all my album pages on Staples 65 lb. cover stock. I use an Epson Artisan 835 printer and it works pretty good. But I just feel the text isn't nearly as crisp and clear as a laser.

So, from my little bit of research, it seems that I MIGHT be able to get a crisper output using a printer that uses pigment based ink, instead of the dye based ink.

Has anyone used a pigment based ink printer? How well does it work compared to dye based printers?

The research I did on the Internet wasn't all that helpful, because most of the discussion revolved around printing photos.
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Posted 09/19/2014   5:43 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Terence Collins to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
It is not just the ink apastuszak, though pigment ink is generally more lightfast than dye based ink. Paper that is sized will give sharper print than unsized paper which can cause the ink to 'feather', or spread tiny filaments of ink into the paper fibre. And dye based ink is more prone to do this than pigment based ink. For printing page headers and boxes I use an Epson photo printer which takes pigment ink and the results are sharp - no feathering. Photo quality printers generally use pigment based inks, but these tend to cost more than general purpose printers. Laserjet printers should give fine results and though the cartridges are pricy they will last much longer than inkjet cartridges. I have not used a laserjet so can't give a personal opinion beyond that.

Making up your print work is best done in Photoshop InDesign or Illustrator as the typesetting will will be vectored and produce much sharper print than make up in standard Photoshop which is pixel based.

This is also a problem for handwriting album notes using pen and ink, which is what I do. I find that best results are got with black pigment India Ink and an old style artists dip pen. I have recently acquired an old Osmiroid artist's fountain pen which can be filled with certain types of pigment India Ink but I have yet to try it. I suspect it will require emptying and cleaning after every use to prevent the feed from clogging.

Terry
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Edited by Terence Collins - 09/19/2014 5:52 pm
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Posted 09/19/2014   9:02 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Hieronymus to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I printed a lot of Steiner pages with a laser printer on 65-lb Wasau acid-free card stock, only to discover that the lines eventually bled, spread out, rubbed away. I switched to inkjet on a modest HP multi-function machine and reprinted hundreds if not thousands of pages on the same kind of paper. They have lasted pretty well to this point (2 years out).

I'm not a purist on the sharpness of lines, so inkjet suits my purposes, but I could readily imagine that others would be less satisfied with inkjet quality. I would think that inkjet on sized paper might be the best combination of quality and economy. But I've now more than exceeded what I know about this stuff and will leave it to the experts.
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Posted 09/19/2014   9:49 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add apastuszak to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I went out and bought the Epson Workforce 2540 printer. It uses pigment based ink. and is on sale at Staples for $89.

Same exact 65 lb. coverstock that used on the dye based Artisan.

Massive improvement in quality!

The Artisan prints were good, but there were just ever so slightly, I guess, fuzzy would be the word to use. The pages just did not look as crisp and clear as they did on a color laser. Not so with the pigment based ink. The blacks are nice and dark Letters are all crisp and sharp. Very impressed and happy with the purchase.
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Posted 09/19/2014   10:00 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add apastuszak to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I printed a lot of Steiner pages with a laser printer on 65-lb Wasau acid-free card stock, only to discover that the lines eventually bled, spread out, rubbed away. I switched to inkjet on a modest HP multi-function machine and reprinted hundreds if not thousands of pages on the same kind of paper. They have lasted pretty well to this point (2 years out).

I'm not a purist on the sharpness of lines, so inkjet suits my purposes, but I could readily imagine that others would be less satisfied with inkjet quality. I would think that inkjet on sized paper might be the best combination of quality and economy. But I've now more than exceeded what I know about this stuff and will leave it to the experts.


I'm pretty sure I know what you did wrong with the laser printer, because I did the same thing. When you print, in the dialog box, there should be a place to select paper type. You HAVE TO select cardstock. Thicker paper requires the fuser in the laser printer to run hotter, to make the toner stick to the page. If you leave it set to standard paper, the toner will not adhere to the paper and will eventually smudge and rub off as the paper cools.
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Posted 09/19/2014   10:01 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add apastuszak to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Paper that is sized will give sharper print than unsized paper which can cause the ink to 'feather', or spread tiny filaments of ink into the paper fibre.


What is sized paper?
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Posted 09/19/2014   10:32 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Terence Collins to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi apastuszak,

Paper can be internally sized or surface sized during its manufacture. It forms a coating on the paper fibres and its surface. It is done to prevent the excessive absorption of inks which would otherwise bleed into the paper fibres causing a 'feathering' of the ink lines, reducing sharpness.

Various size preparations are used depending on the type of paper and its intended use. Sizing ingredients include modified starches, gelatines, acrylic polymers, and alkyl anhydrides. Very expensive art papers are often sized and glazed with a clay based preparation.

In plain terms the size prevents the over absorption of the ink, and its spread horizontally into the paper fibres giving the appearance of a fuzzy edge to the ink line. All good art, calligraphy, and drawing papers are sized. As are all good writing papers.

Hope this helps and is useful.
Terry
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Edited by Terence Collins - 09/19/2014 10:34 pm
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Posted 09/19/2014   10:43 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add apastuszak to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Ok, I scanned the two pages. I don't know how well it will show the difference, but it's worth looking at.

Epson Artisan 835 with dye based ink on Staples 67 lb. white coverstock scanned at 300 dpi"



Epson Workforce 2540 with pigment based ink on Staples 67 lb. white coverstock scanned at 300 dpi.

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Free Ukrainian Stamp Album and modified Mystic Stamp Album Pages - http://www.stamphacks.com
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Posted 09/19/2014   10:45 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add apastuszak to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Hi apastuszak,

Paper can be internally sized or surface sized during its manufacture. It forms a coating on the paper fibres and its surface. It is done to prevent the excessive absorption of inks which would otherwise bleed into the paper fibres causing a 'feathering' of the ink lines, reducing sharpness.

Various size preparations are used depending on the type of paper and its intended use. Sizing ingredients include modified starches, gelatines, acrylic polymers, and alkyl anhydrides. Very expensive art papers are often sized and glazed with a clay based preparation.

In plain terms the size prevents the over absorption of the ink, and its spread horizontally into the paper fibres giving the appearance of a fuzzy edge to the ink line. All good art, calligraphy, and drawing papers are sized. As are all good writing papers.

Hope this helps and is useful.
Terry


Do they make sized coverstock/cardstock that I can buy in a ream, like I do other printer paper?
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Posted 09/19/2014   11:49 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add BeeSee to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I'm pretty sure I know what you did wrong with the laser printer, because I did the same thing. When you print, in the dialog box, there should be a place to select paper type. You HAVE TO select cardstock. Thicker paper requires the fuser in the laser printer to run hotter, to make the toner stick to the page. If you leave it set to standard paper, the toner will not adhere to the paper and will eventually smudge and rub off as the paper cools.


Right on Andy. I have been using laser printers for my pages for 20 years, and they are super sharp to this day, even the oldest pages.
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Posted 09/20/2014   04:25 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Terence Collins to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi apastuszak

Quick look on line at Office Depot shows

Neenah Exact Vellum Bristol coverstock 67lb white 8.5 x 11 inches, from Office Depot ( don't know if they do larger).
Described as fast drying, no smearing, dry in seconds, for clear crisp results. They don't specifically mention sizing (they may term this 'coated'), so a call might be worth the trouble. Ask them to send you some test samples.

Alternatively, if you use a lot, it would be worth talking to a paper merchant about this and they should send you some samples to test. I buy a medium heavy semi smooth paper (best for writing up with pen and ink) and get it cut. I do my own cutting and punching if I have to. Better chance of getting what you like and if you buy enough should be cheaper per ream.

Your test printings on enlargement show a superior print quality from the Epson Workforce using pigment based inks (Second sample below). Which software did you use for your typesetting?

Terry



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Edited by Terence Collins - 09/20/2014 05:04 am
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Posted 09/20/2014   09:09 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add apastuszak to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I do all my layout in an open source DTP app called Scribus (http://www.scribus.net).

I generated a PDF with embedded fonts and printed it out using FoxIt PDF reader.
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Free Ukrainian Stamp Album and modified Mystic Stamp Album Pages - http://www.stamphacks.com
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Eire Philatelic Association Member #2869: http://www.eirephilatelicassoc.org/
Edited by apastuszak - 09/20/2014 09:11 am
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Posted 09/20/2014   09:47 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add apastuszak to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
From my understanding, pigment based ink is not paper dependent. Since the pigment will not soak into the paper the way dye based ink does, you can't get bleed and spidering.

My Internet research tells me that dye based ink is a solution and can soak into the paper. Pigment based ink is a suspension of particles. Though the fluid the particles is suspended in might soak into the paper, the actual particles will always sit on the surface and not bleed.
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Free Ukrainian Stamp Album and modified Mystic Stamp Album Pages - http://www.stamphacks.com
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Eire Philatelic Association Member #2869: http://www.eirephilatelicassoc.org/
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Posted 09/20/2014   11:20 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Terence Collins to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Pretty much it, apastuszak. You are right about dye based inks, these are made from liquid chemical dyes and a liquid carrier medium. They tend to be more fluid and are preferred by the makers of cheap printers as they present less of a problem with blocked jets. But being fluid they get absorbed more readily by the paper fibres. Which is why glossy coated photo printer paper is needed to get a decent photo print. Dye based inks fade whether exposed to light or not. Just takes a bit longer in the dark.

Pigment based inks are made from natural pigment particles suspended in a medium. Like India Ink the pigment printer ink will sit on the surface of the paper, just a little being absorbed with the medium by the paper. This is why it is necessary to allow the ink to dry and set for a few hours before handling or using the paper. I leave it to dry overnight. Once the pigment ink is set and the excess medium has dried off, the ink is bonded to the paper surface. Good pigment inks are highly light fast and will last much longer than dye based inks. And as you say, can be used on a much wider range of papers, including art papers. Best results will still be obtained with sized or coated papers.

Not quite as good as India Ink. This stuff was used by the Egyptians way back in the Old Kingdoms for drawing and writing on clay tablets and pottery, and can still be read today some thousands of years later.

Eat your hearts out Epson, Canon, HP et al.

Terry

PS: I have Scribus on my Mac but haven't used it yet. Still need to figure out how to import typefaces in to it. Basic reading still to do. Looks good, though. TC.
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Edited by Terence Collins - 09/20/2014 11:23 am
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Posted 09/20/2014   11:54 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add pk-short to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
To highlight what Hieronymus said, I have Steiner pages going back to 2000. One album I took to work and printed on a laser printer is "bleeding" onto other pages and onto the back of the stamps. I've been moving those to inkjet printed pages. The inkjet printed pages back from 2000 don't have any problems. I use standard HP inks - if you read the fine print on the boxes, they do claim to be "archival" and acid free.
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Posted 09/20/2014   3:39 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Terence Collins to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Take heart. This was a problem for the old masters who used oak gall or iron gall ink for their drawings. In areas where ink was applied thickly on the paper the tannic and sulphuric acid constituent of the ink would, over time, burn holes through the paper. The ink also changed colour as it aged, often resulting in several hues from yellow to strong black in the same drawing.

Terry
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