Should International Philately Develop A Single System For Philatelic Identification???

Here is something from 1998...I can send the full file if anyone wants it. This was one of the original discussion items in the Philatelic Computing Study Group (now disbanded).

Al

======================
Charter
of the
Universal Catalog Numbering System

(Draft Copy)

March 21, 1998

Table of Contents

I. Introduction 0
II. Purpose 0
III. Definitions 0
IV. Top Level Considerations 2
Mission Statement 2
Mission Objectives 2
System Concept 3
V. UCNS Catalog Number 3
Definition 3
Component Descriptions 3
Examples 3
VI. Responsibilities 4
Controller Responsibilities 4
System Management and Maintenance. 4
Database Control 4
Authorization and Control of Curators 4
Curator Responsibilities 4
VI. Database Structure 5
VII. Field Specifications 5
VIII. Standards 5
IX. Software Specifications 6
Web site 6
Database test and maintenance 6
User data selection and download 6
Curator list generation 7
X. Copyright 7
Appendix A: Historical Background 1
Appendix B: UCNS Committee Members 1
Appendix C: Database Model 1
Appendix D: Database Field Specifications 1
Table of Current Country/Area and Brevity Code Standard Values 25
Table of Former Country/Area and Brevity Code Standard Values 3
Table of Currency Standard Values 12
Table of Paper Standard Values 13
Table of Shape Standard Values 14
Table of Gum Standard Values 17
Table of Luminescence Standard Values 17
Table of Type Standard Values 18
Table of Language Standard Values 18
Table of Color Standard Values (TBD) 18
Table of Topic Standard Values (To Be Supplied as Available) 19

Appendix C: Database Model C-1

Appendix D: Database Field Specifications D-1

Appendix E: Data Standards E-1

Appendix F: Related Literature F-1

Scott's numbering system works well enough for US stamps, but it royally sucks for many (most?) other countries. A country may issue a set of 10 stamps, and if there are airmails and semipostals included, stamps from that set are listed in 3 (or more) sections of the catalog. If they must assign them catalog numbers such as B1, C1, etc, it would be nice if they could still list them chronologically along with regular issues. They could color-code airmails and semipostals if they wanted to make them easier to find in the catalog. Album layouts make much more sense done this way as well, rather than having sets broken up and the chronology somewhat out of whack.

I think peoples are too lazy, they want colour photos of every stamps in their album and the Scott # too . ID stamps is a fun part of the hobby and the fact we have so many different catalogues, make it even more challenging, so more funds.

My recent comment on another thread about Persia reminded me of this thread. All the talk here is about catalogs that are based in North America and Europe. What about other, more obscure, catalogs that deal with un-expected countries. To negotiate the morass that is early Persia/Iran, with all the reprints and forgeries, one needs the Persiphila catalogs. Scott is of little help. I have not seen Gibbons, Michel, Yvert, but would suspect they don't have the background of Persiphila either. Then there is Bale for Israel forerunners, and so on.

I got a great idea that will help --------We could charge every poster on every stamp chat board in the world a dollar per posting for the next five years and that will help fund the project . Then we could give this money to a few high paid "CATALOG NAZIS " in Switzerland who could tell us what a real worldwide catalog should look like and they could build their own gravy train by demanding fees to use "THEIR" numbering systems from everybody . -------{off to school to fight with a few young 20's and 30's year old cagefighters to get rid of my aggression.}

Steve your point is the issue that started me on this whole issue. Users of specialized catalogues face the double hurdle because they tend to not be used by general dealers. The Persiphila (or its Iranian-produced alternative, Farahbakhsh, the 2015 edition of which I own) would be a great example. What a tool like what I am thinking of would allow is a cross reference from the specialized number in Persiphila or Farahbakhsh that would give at least the base stamp ID number in the main catalogs.

If the main catalogues do not list the variety from the specialized catalog, (lets create a hypothetical example - call it Farahbakhsh 184) then that could be denoted in the database with something along the lines of say Farahbakhsh 184 equates to Michel 205VAR or Scott 167VAR so that a collector would know at least what base stamp to look at when hunting down (and perhaps finding laying unknown in the dealer's stock) the variety in the specialized catalog.

Specialists can get certain varieties that they discovered from dealers who don't know for the same price as a regular stamp. However, they also want their variety to be acknowledged by others like collectors, catalogues, etc. Thus, these two things are sort of a balancing act. Is there a right for others to know by the discoverer publishing in philately for new varieties? What if the discoverer manages to corner the market before revealing anything? It is possible someone else could make the discovery if they wait too long. There are many considerations involved here. Also, what if the variety is rare but there is indifference to it by the catalogues which can also mean indifference by dealers as well to it which really means that everyone loses especially collectors in the long run? How specialized should a specialized catalogue be? Since I am fascinated by stamps I have bought specialized catalogues in the past such as Michel Germany Specialized even though I didn't collect German stamps just to read, look and admire a great specialized stamp catalogue.

My position on this would be, to quote a poster on another stamp forum, "Knowledge is Power." Not that I am thinking of making a new catalogue, but if I were to create a simple catalogue ID correlation app there is no reason NOT to include specialized catalogue numbers even if the main catalogs do not give the specialized variety a listing itself. Hence the ###VAR listing I noted above.

If nothing else, collectors who notice there are a lot of ###VAR listings for their collecting interest might be more encouraged to obtain a copy of the specialized catalogue to find out more information.

Its high time somebody took the initiative. A comprehensive list can help reduce forged stamps, and help new collectors learn more about the stamps. An alpha numeric code with name of the country followed by year and then the serial number would be ideal

A waste of time and a little problem of who is going to pay for it and where does the control of the numbering system sit with .
Helping other collectors and displaying your own collection sounds more productive activity for a chat board than wishing to redesign the world .

If someone is looking for a list, then the specialist societies can supplement this area. A unique numbering system is not solving the issue. You can use any existing numbering system and adapt since every variety is likely covering by a number already.

Well, creating a new system from scratch that actually takes hold in the marketplace is probably not going to happen. A more likely scenario (although not by much) is that one of the existing catalog publishers emerges as the dominant player and is accepted worldwide.

This really wasn't much of an issue until the internet age. Really, in 1970, for example, how many US collectors bought stamps from German sellers or vice versa? I can now go to ebay Germany and shop thousands of German sellers from my couch, whereas 30+ years ago, I wouldn't have had an easy way to shop a single one.

I created a universal identification protocol which has been in existence since 1995. It was created by StampFinder to facilitate the first multi-dealer website. It is a system of country and section prefixes to the actual catalog number. The system has some 6000 prefixes and adjusts for the fact that various catalogs group stamps differently. They also have created a list of variety codes to address individual stamps characteristics. The system is freely available, but is copyrighted to assure control of the assignment of new numbers to prevent its corruption. It has not been widely publicized because collectors don't need to know these numbers since they find their wants via pull down menus and don't have to be burdened with looking up from 6000 codes. Dealers have to use the codes, but swiftly learn the logic behind them and usually don't have to look an item up. Anyone who wants to see the list can request it, it comes in an excel format. r.lehmann

Rich711: A number of us have commented on the likelihood of a new system propagating widely.

Twenty years in, is there a second website that uses this scheme?

Cheers,

/s/ ikeyPikey

I think it much more useful to generate a listing that describes each stamp, rather than using a number. It's so much more likely to be useful when it's not tied to a specific country catalog or an arbitrary numbering sequence. If we end up arguing, it'll be about the definition of what the 'candle flame' variety is on the USA 1 cent blue of 1890 (to link to another thread here...).