West German Cancelled To Order Stamps?

I came across a packet of stamps from West Germany (BRD) that have all the earmarks of CTOs, a corner cancel and full gum. I could find no reference to CTOs from the BRD in my Michel. Did I miss something?
If they were favor cancelled, why do it like that? Is this a custom among German collectors? I've posted an example below.
Any input would be appreciated.
Dan

I have several that look like those in my Dutch collection. Back in the 50's I would go to the post office and have an envelope canceled without mailing it. I would then soak off the stamps because I only collected used stamps. These stamps were neatly canceled, just a corner as above. Yes, I guess in a way they were CTO's?

Peter

Peter,

The difference here is that the nice, shiny gum is still intact. The picture may not show it well.
So, these were perhaps favor cancelled because the collector preferred used to mint?
Dan

Well, that could be. That is why it is so difficult. In your case it is most likely CTO because of the gum.
By the way, I could not see the gum on the picture - I might have answered different had I known!

Peter

Peter,

Your answer makes sense. I know East Germany produced CTO's by the thousands. I was really wondering if West Germany did the same for collectors and I just wasn't aware of it. I don't think they did.
If a CTO wasn't officially produced by the government, the most sensible answer was what you said: the collector preferred cancelled stamps over mint and didn't bother soaking. I guess that's one way to be sure to get a nice cancel.
Thanks for your input!
Dan

Dan, I do know one thing about CTO's. I collect Swiss stamps, used and if I order directly from the Swiss Post they send me stamps that seem to have the postmark printed on it!

Peter

Peter,

I'm fairly certain that these cancellations were not printed on the stamp. My picture doesn't show it well but the indentation from the handstamp is noticeable on the gum.
I don't think it was a standard policy of the Bundespost but rather a hand-back favor cancel for a collector. Michel Spezial is pretty detailed and most likely would have made a note of such a procedure. My German isn't that good and I thought I may have missed something. Michel is pretty detailed about officially produced CTO's for East Germany; they even give CTO stamps a separate value column and a separate icon, a shaded circle. .
Dan

Dan,
I was working on a dealers stock of modern Austrian stamps some time ago, and I found loads of these, all neatly cancelled - with the gum intact. Some with beautiful and rather artificial SOTN postmarks - and others with only the corners affected, like yours. However the postmarks were clearly not added at the printers - the heavy duplication in the dealers stock showed various postmarks added, all by hand in slightly different positions from one stamp to another - but also clearly resulting from some sort of mass-production. In my world that would be more or less the same as CTO - or favor cancels. We've all seen this from lots of countries in Africa, Asia, Eastern Europe - and even Scandinavia, represented by Greenland and the Faroes. But honestly I was surprised to find this from Austria I don't know about BRD, but would assume the Austrian and German collectors have more or less the same custom?

Each to it's own

I recently found a whole string of French stamps from the 60s obviously cancelled to order or for favour - perhaps the latter, for a collector buying mint copies of new issues and also wanting a parallel used copy with a neat cancellation.

Is there a list anywhere of CTO countries? It would be interesting to see which countries have done this. Is my understanding correct that countries did this as a way to raise revenue from collectors?

Blaamand, what is BRD?

Peter

BRD - Bundesrepublik Deutschland - West Germany

Basically, yes. Collectors can get used stamps from the mail, of course, but the postal service makes nothing off that, you see. They could sell cancelled stamps (that hadn't carried mail) at a discount off of face, and the collector would get a neatly cancelled stamp without having to soak them off paper. In theory it's a win-win, but most collectors see CTO as something that's contrived and most prefer postally used stamps over CTO. CTO's were generally sold by dealers to beginners and casual collectors. There's nothing wrong with collecting them (I have many in my collection) but they are often kind of looked down upon by quote-unquote "serious" collectors.

Outside of the U.S. c.t.o.'s are gaining in popularity. There was a post here that stated c.t.o. prices were higher than postally used in at least one country which I believe is in Europe. China is another country where c.t.o. is in demand. That perfectionist collector.

Looks like a privately done favor-cancelled specimen to me.

The official West German CTOs (provided for new issue subscribers) usually have got a MUCH stronger and better quality (no smudging etc) strike on the postmark (Frankfurt or Berlin being most common places).

Re, topic of CTO's in general... A dear child has got many names. Take a look of something such as American Commemorative Cancellations (formerly called Souvenir Pages) which was a USPS sanctioned philatelic product for several decades. Those are nothing but 100% CTOs glued on sheet of paper - and USPS sold them with a nice premium to US collectors...What goes around comes around.

-k-

Thanks all for your help!
I've been collecting for a long time and have never come across a favor cancel on a mint stamp before, just official CTO's. Interesting! Now I have a boatload!
I'm learning something new all the time!
Dan