How Did Early Collectors Keep Stamps Mnh??

Actually, I don't think early collectors gave any thought to MNH. Their interest was in the stamp, or cancel, not the backside.

When early collectors did concern themselves with gum, it was likely they were planning to remove it.

Glassine envelopes have been around since the early 1900s and some collectors used them to store stamps, more often duplicates than the official "collection" copy which likely would have been hinged in an album. But glassine was definitely one storage solution.

rgstamp: thank you for pointing out that Siegel sale from last fall. I agree with you that there were some very serious Scott#'s in that sale and if you had money to burn, and were not really concerned about resale, you could have come away with some serious bargains. There were so many beautiful stamps in that collection that it is hard to remember them all. I stopped at Scott 122 but do remember the unused 13, 16, 34, the enormously margined 45 and the list goes on. I also note the number of very early PF certificates--I think I saw one from 1958. It would be interesting to know when the owner amassed these stamps and how he made out overall compared to his cost. However, the percentage of catalog discount for no gum, sound, XF centered stamps should be sobering for collectors in the late 1980's and later who thought they were not only buying what they liked but also had a reasonable chance of at a minimum getting a reasonable return of original investment back when sold. This sale tells me that unless you bought a long time ago or bought the absolute best copy of an existent, then your collection like many other collectible fields, joins new cars and boats as being immediately depreciable as soon as they are driven off the lot.

funcity,

as you pointed out, that sale proves that no gum or regum stamps are relatively affordable for US classics compared to there OG counterparts. The Scott no-gum #12-15, 28, 31-34 are mesmerizing. The owner basically collected almost every classic US stamp in unused condition, and gum was not a priority until you get into his 20th century stamps. Most of the higher value pictorial issue stamps have no gum, but they are indeed beautifully centered and sound. It just amazes me how a stamp with only vf centering but has original gum goes for 2-3x premium compared to an XF centered stamp with no gum. The XF stamp is just better to look at it! Regardless, I wonder if we are at a market low for the unused, no gum stamp (mint if you like the term). What has always scared me is when a premium goes up high and fast (in this case especially for MNH), the fakers and forgers and doctors come out of the shadows and flood the market with great regum jobs, "redistributed" gum, and false claims of OG by ebay sellers, dealer shops, and even reputable auction houses.

rg

sadly, the Hanover sale, which included original gum, many NH early classics, (some stamps at the top of the PSE pop) had an incredible number of unsold lots. I don't even think a lot sold for Scott #5-20. I think out of the first 30 lots, like 25 went unsold. Many of these stamps are being recycled again at auction this year through Siegel, looking for a home! Perhaps the reserves have been brought down and bargains could be had (if you consider paying 3000$ and up for a stamp a bargain)

I spent some time online looking for vintage newspaper items regarding stamp collecting supplies and also the history of glassine, and, as usual, came up with nothing. Perhaps an online archive of early stamp publications would help, if one exists...

I wouldn't call the NH craze a "plot" but I do think there was a certain degree of "collusion" involved, meaning that once the collectibles people (silver, gold, baseball cards, Beanie Babies, toys, and so on) got ahold of stamp collecting in about the mid-1970s, all of a sudden we had the NH phenomenon. That came from somewhere, and saying it was market-driven sounds just fine for why it kept going (to make money!)--but where did it come from in the first place?

It came from a burst of enthusiasm for collectibles in the inflation-ridden '70s combined with a new (or maybe they were old) group of stamp "investment" dealers. I remember the stamp market being tracked like it was the stock market. Even Linn's Stamp News had a "Dow Jones" bar graph to show the rising prices. It got a little silly.

In an inflation-ravaged national economy, collectibles were claimed to hold their value better than stocks, bonds, and so on, and this included even Beanie Babies and new in-the-box toys, and so on. It was about money, not stamp quality. If you slather "gum" on the back of an ugly stamp, it doesn't get more attractive. The same for a beautiful stamp. You can't even see the gum when the stamp is mounted in an album. You could argue that a thin which isn't visible from the front of the stamp is the same thing, but a thin endangers the integrity of the stamp so avoiding stamps with thins makes sense. Gum, or lack of it, doesn't. In fact in some ways gum is potentially damaging to stamps. The gum can stick the stamp to the page, ruining it forever. Or the gum can crack, ruining the front of the stamp. I happens. Stamps without gum don't do that.

There's nothing "natural" about the interest in gum on the back of stamps all of a sudden. It was a demand invented by stamp speculators. It was created by people who wanted to be able to sell something at a higher price, and purchased by people who hoped to protect the value of their investments. This same thing had once been done (in the Netherlands) with tulip bulbs. That made no sense then, either. Or it made sense if you made money. But most people lost money. Will the MNH craze also disappear, leaving many collector-investors holding onto overpriced stamps? Don't know.

Imagine if a few art dealers decided to jack up the price of paintings that had never been hung before. Dealer: "But this work of art doesn't even have screw holes in the frame. It's never been on a wall. That's why we charge twice as much as if it had been hanging on the wall somewhere." No one would buy that logic for art. Why buy it for stamps? The origin of the MNH craze was market-driven only if you're referring to stamp speculators.

That the phenomenon continues is a little ridiculous today. Remember "slabbed" stamps? They were stamp collecting's answer to "slabbed" baseball cards, cards sealed inside plastic cases so no one could ever touch them. This was supposed to set their price higher as a protected investment, one that could not be damaged. Do collectors buy slabbed stamps? If I did, the first thing I'd do is break open the plastic and take out the stamp so it could breathe again. The investment world can get awfully silly at times.

This doesn't mean stamps aren't a good investment. Maybe they are, maybe they aren't.

But there's also another way to look at it. While the eyes of the big money collectors are on MNH (untouched, unbreathed upon . . . ) stamps in "minty" condition, for very good prices I can buy lots of excellent quality stamps with hinge marks on the back or (horror or horrors!) no gum at all. That's just fine with me. Choosing between a MNH stamp and an excellent hinged stamp, I'll go with the latter if the price is a good deal lower. I'll leave the "investing" part of collecting to others. And keep in mind that if the MNH investors do really well it may drive up the prices of stamps you'd like to buy.

Back to the original question:
- Some stamps may have been saved for postal use but never used.
- Or they were stored in glassine or regular envelopes, or a stock book, perhaps as a collector's second or third copy of a stamp.
- Or they were mounted in an album as part of a multiple or with selvage attached, with the hinge applied to one of the other stamps or the selvage.
- Some MNH classic era stamps have been regummed or "steamed" to remove the hinge mark. This further points up how silly MNH really is. I wonder if you could lick off the hinge mark? Would it make them worth twice as much if I licked the hinge marks off the back of some of my stamps?

Agree 100 percent. While my 20th Century USA is "MNH", my 19th Century stamps are not I don't really care about the back of these stamps. To me, its the front that count.

Jack Kelley

DrewM,
That is probably the best explanation I have ever heard of the MNH phenomenon. You forgot to mention that Scott colluded in this by expressly stating in their catalogs that after a certain date the prices they list for mint are for MNH. Personally, I feel that the cost in money for the mounts and time to mount most common MNH stamps is not worth it and I use hinges.

Respectfully disagree that the primary driver is some kind of profit making. The desire to own something that has not been modified is pretty high in a lot of other collectibles. Antiques are a good example, often untouched originals are more sought after than anything that has been changed. Original condition vintage cars also command a premium. Ditto on collectible books. Try selling a collectible baseball card that was pinned up on a kids door with a tack. People just like collecting all things in as original condition as possible. Hence the huge premium for collectible toys in original boxes.

I think the reasoning is pretty simple; after decades of time untouched original things are rarer than those which have been changed in some way.

We can fuss all we want about MNH classic stamps but no one can argue that they are not unusual and rare.
Don

My understanding is that this actually started in Germany, back in the '70s or '80s.

All this requires is a little thought exercise. Say a dealer had 100 examples of a stamp, varying from superb-nh all the way down to ugly, faulty used copies. If they were priced all the same, which one would you pick? Most collectors would select the superb NH example. In any given grade, most collectors would choose NH over hinged if they were all priced the same. Said hypothetical dealer would notice this and would start adjusting his prices upwards on the NH stamps. Sooner or later the premium for NH would get high enough that fewer collectors would be willing to pay it and would settle for hinged examples. Prices for NH and hinged stamps are governed by the same forces that govern almost all prices: supply and demand.

Where marketing comes into play is in trying to convince more collectors that its worth paying 2x, 3x, 5x or even more for an NH copy. But again if they were priced the same, almost every collector who collects mint stamps would select NH over hinged. Most collectors already see some value in NH, even if it's just picking them first amongst equal price items. This assumes, of course, that one isn't going to turn around and hinge the stamps themselves.

As mystified as some folks are about the MNH "craze" (as some put it), I am equally mystified by the obsession some of these folks have with collectors who favor MNH stamps. Echoing one poster above, some folks just happen to like collecting items in as close to their original condition as possible. If they have to consider whether it's worth paying more for MNH versus MH or no gum (and how much more), if they have to careful about being duped by regummers and other charlatans, if they have to consider how to maintain the condition of their MNH stamps and if they have to consider the cost of obtaining certs verifying the quality and condition of their stamps, that's their affair. Just as the folks who are content to collect MH, used, precancels, CTOs, FDCs or whatever are entitled to happily go through life doing such. Everyone has his or her opinion and is certainly entitled to it, but I am perplexed at the lengthy screeds that have appeared in more than a few threads about this MNH business. The more thoughtful commentary about the pitfalls to avoid and considerations to take into account are certainly helpful and in some cases illuminating, but at the end of the day, why does anyone care that much about what some other collector chooses to focus on?

Well said, Don and Oracle. Respecting another's collecting preferences is common courtesy and, if we want our hobby to grow and thrive, common sense. Portraying collectors of MNH stamps as just speculative investors or big money collectors is unfair to many NH-collecting folks who are neither.