Stamp Community Family of Web Sites
Thousands of stamps, consistently graded, competitively priced and hundreds of in-depth blog posts to read








Stamp Community Forum
 
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

This page may contain links that result in small commissions to keep this free site up and running.

Welcome Guest! Registering and/or logging in will remove the anchor (bottom) ads. It's Free!

Postal Service In The Roman States 1826 Italy, What Is Provincia Del Patrimonio?

 
To participate in the forum you must log in or register.
Author Previous TopicReplies: 9 / Views: 1,412Next Topic  
Valued Member

Switzerland
251 Posts
Posted 03/06/2018   08:00 am  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add codexluminati to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
Don't know if this is the right forum to post it, but here I go:

I found this old document about the mailing system in the _Roman states in 1826, and have a question about the Tuesday mail departure; It says the mail for all the Roman states (stato Pontificio), and any foreign destination, except "Provincia del patrimonio". What is Provincia del patrimonio?

Also, the part I find astonishing is the courrier that leaves on saturday, 1 hour after midnight, accepting the mail until 2 hours before midnight.


Send note to Staff

Pillar Of The Community
United States
911 Posts
Posted 03/06/2018   08:41 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add SPQR to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I think the "Provinca del Patrimonio" is a reference to the Patrimony of St. Peter's that was the postal (and administrative) district of Rome and nearby communities that were administered directly by Rome rather than one of the other provinces. It would roughly be the modern Metropolitan City of Rome Capital within the Lazio Region of Italy.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Valued Member
Ireland
292 Posts
Posted 03/06/2018   08:59 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add FitzjamesHorse to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I think that's true. I know there was a group of major basilicas and lands within Rome that had some quasi-independence from the Pope. One of these churches was St John the Baptist but I don't know the others.
Maybe collectively they were known as the Provinca del Patrimonio I cant say.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United States
911 Posts
Posted 03/06/2018   09:33 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add SPQR to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
FitzjamesHorse - I think you are referring to the extraterritorial properties of the Vatican following the Lateran Treaty in 1929 which established the Vatican state and gave it control of some of the major churches in Rome including Santa Maria Maggiore, San Giovanni in Laterano, and San Paolo fuori le Mura, as well as Castel Gandolfo. The Patrimony of St. Peter's was back before Italian reunification in the 1860s, when the Pope was the ruler of much of the central part of the Italian peninsula.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Valued Member
Switzerland
251 Posts
Posted 03/06/2018   10:35 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add codexluminati to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks SPQR, love to learn something every day.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United Kingdom
3211 Posts
Posted 03/06/2018   3:32 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add nigelc to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi codexluminati,

I think "La Provincia del Patrimonio" may refer to the Province of Viterbo.


Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Nigel
Pillar Of The Community
United States
911 Posts
Posted 03/06/2018   4:30 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add SPQR to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
nigelc -
why would Provincia del Patrimonio refer to Viterbo?
Also, Viterbo is listed in a few places on the postal document
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United Kingdom
3211 Posts
Posted 03/06/2018   4:54 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add nigelc to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Well it's guesswork but here's my thinking.

The mail on Tuesdays is for the "whole Papal State, and any foreign destination, except for the Provincia del Patrimonio".

If the Provincia del Patrimonio were far from Rome I don't see what difference it would make being a Tuesday as opposed to a Thursday or a Saturday.

Also I wouldn't expect it to be a location in Rome on the same grounds.

I assume it is a geographical province within the Papal States (or possibly a very close neighbour) so that it would make a material difference to the mail transport.

The document does refer to the town of Viterbo as opposed to the province in terms of mail coach routes.

I think this is relevant too as there are scheduled mail coaches to Viterbo on Thursdays and Saturdays but not on Tuesdays.

Googling for combinations of Viterbo and Provincia del Patrimonio gave me some hits including a book referring in Italian to Viterbo and the Provincia del Patrimonio.

I don't see this as proof, as references of the form "X and the heritage province" or "X and the province of the patrimony" may have wider applications but the Province of Viterbo does seem a good candidate given the depth of the papal history associated with the town.







Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Nigel
Pillar Of The Community
Learn More...
United States
663 Posts
Posted 03/06/2018   5:33 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add oldguy to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
It appears that Patrimonio translated in English to "estate" or "property". [http://dictionary.reverso.net/itali...h/patrimonio] So perhaps it is saying that the mails go out to everywhere on Tuesday except locally?
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Valued Member
Switzerland
251 Posts
Posted 03/06/2018   6:58 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add codexluminati to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Found it!.
I kept looking with the info nigel gave, and found (in italian) the 11 provinces that composed the papal state in 1820, nominating in #3 la provincia del patrimonio (Viterbo, Orvieto, Civitavecchia):

Nel 1820 lo Stato era ripartito in 11 Province a loro volta composte da delegazioni di 1ª, 2ª e 3ª classe:
1 Marittima e Campagna (Roma, Tivoli, Subiaco, Frosinone, Terracina, Anagni, Pontecorvo)
2 Sabina (Rieti, Poggio Mirteto)
3 Patrimonio (Viterbo, Orvieto, Civitavecchia)
4 Umbria (Perugia, Città di Castello, Foligno, Todi, Spoleto, Norcia, Terni)
5 Camerino
6 Marche (Macerata, Severino, Fabriano, Loreto, Fermo, Ascoli, Montalto, Ancona, Jesi, Osimo)
7 Urbino (Urbino, Pesaro, Fano, Sinigaglia, Gubbio)
8 Romagna (Ravenna, Imola, Faenza, Forlì, Cesena, Rimini)
9 Bologna
10 Ferrara
11 Benevento

Thank you all for helping resolve this.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
  Previous TopicReplies: 9 / Views: 1,412Next Topic  
 
To participate in the forum you must log in or register.

Go to Top of Page

Disclaimer: While a tremendous amount of effort goes into ensuring the accuracy of the information contained in this site, Stamp Community assumes no liability for errors. Copyright 2005 - 2026 Stamp Community Family - All rights reserved worldwide. Use of any images or content on this website without prior written permission of Stamp Community or the original lender is strictly prohibited.
Privacy Policy / Terms of Use    Advertise Here
Stamp Community Forum © 2007 - 2026 Stamp Community Forums
It took 0.18 seconds to lick this stamp. Powered By: Snitz Forums 2000 Version 3.4.05