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France Ceres Classics, I Need Help Classifying.

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United States
912 Posts
Posted 11/26/2020   12:04 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add rgstamp to your friends list Get a Link to this Message





Back to stamp collecting in the COVID19 world- stuck in house all weekend!

these were given to me by relative. I wanted to give example of album I am dealing with so I scanned in page 2 of the album. The album is 19th century France only as well as French colonies 19th century only. I am trying to sort through this as many stamps misidentified, etc.

I took some stamps off of page 1 and scanned them.

I have done research- many of stamps have thins, small tears etc.
I am just trying to get stamps in their correct spots. And of course trying to identify fakes/forgeries.

Scott 1 10c Ceres: first stamp appears to have OG and is signed on back but I cannot make out signature. I think middle stamp with largest cancel is a forgery, but not sure? Are these France or French colonies, are they reprints?

40c and 25c appear very nice, are they reprints? is the 40c a French colony?

I am looking for some direction here. Any early France experts out there?

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France, Metropolitan
2985 Posts
Posted 11/26/2020   1:17 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add perf12 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Nice collection.The 40c Orange-red is no. 5a from 1850.It's a nice stamp.
The 1Fr. carmine far right is nice to.It has all 4 borders.
Can you post a pic(front and bavck) of the 10c mint with the signature?
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Canada
712 Posts
Posted 11/26/2020   1:50 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add gmot to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Certainly not an expert, but a very nice grouping, I like the 5fr Napoleons and lozenge cancels in there.
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Posted 11/26/2020   2:16 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rgstamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply




looks like two thins. (corner and upper margin)
I thought that was a signature, now I am not sure what the writing is?
Amazing what you see on a scan versus what you see under a little magnifier on the desk

re: the 40c and 25c. Can you tell they are France by cancel? (vs French Colony)

the 20c black bottom right stamp is forgery I believe- the "2" at bottom has different shape
the 10c middle stamp upper with cool cancel is also forgery I think. letters are different shape/size than other stamps
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France, Metropolitan
2985 Posts
Posted 11/26/2020   2:45 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add perf12 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
So it is a nice France no.1. your Ceres 10c.
Ye, I beleive the 40c 1st row second stamp + 25c second row 3rd stamp are colony cancels.
THe 20c you mention is on white paper.It is a common stamp.
The 3rd stamp in the 10c stamp row has a 'grille sans fin ' cancel.It is scarcer than the lozenge cancel types.
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Edited by perf12 - 11/26/2020 3:01 pm
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Australia
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Posted 11/26/2020   8:46 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Bobby De La Rue to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The numeral cancel on the 5th 10c stamp is Sarreguemines if number 2811 or Sartilly if number 2814.

For the 25c stamp with the lozenge cancel with the E visible, I think it's a Paris Gare De L'est. See this page of (in my opinion) one of the top 2 or 3 philatelic websites out there:

http://marcophilie.org/oblba.html
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Posted 11/26/2020   10:00 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rgstamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Bobby

Are you suggesting that the 25 c is France and not French colony?
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Australia
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Posted 11/26/2020   10:39 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Bobby De La Rue to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I have a limited knowledge of early French postmarks but virtually no knowledge of the cancellations of the French colonies.

If it is a French colony cancel, I'd be most interested to know what it is!

That said, according to the catalogue (Scott Classic Specialised) the colour looks wrong to be the French Colonies issue.
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Edited by Bobby De La Rue - 11/26/2020 10:48 pm
Pillar Of The Community
France, Metropolitan
2985 Posts
Posted 11/27/2020   04:21 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add perf12 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The..E.... is a colonie generales cancel 'MQE' for Martinique.
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United States
912 Posts
Posted 11/27/2020   06:52 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rgstamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks to both of you. Challenging stuff.
I have decided to remove most of the stamps (better ones) and re mount my own pages
I have some other old France and French colony in a box, so will be working on mixing together to make a more presentable album that is at least reasonably accurate in identification

I appreciate the help


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Posted 11/27/2020   09:19 am  Show Profile Check KRelyea's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add KRelyea to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
How can you tell the unused 10c is SC #1 and not the 1862 reissue SC #1g?

PS. Very nice stamps!
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United States
912 Posts
Posted 11/27/2020   09:33 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rgstamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Did reprints have gum?

Better yet.. krelyea ... it's unused without cancel... could be French colony?

Welcome to my pain

Moving these stamps around like a rapid chess match

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Posted 11/27/2020   09:51 am  Show Profile Check KRelyea's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add KRelyea to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I feel your pain, I have an unused #3 and I'm facing the same problem. The reissues do have gum. For #3 the cat $ is pretty close but for the #1 it is a lot higher than the 1g.
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France, Metropolitan
2985 Posts
Posted 11/27/2020   09:52 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add perf12 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The reprint is of a lighter shade.The stamp next to it on the right is a colonies generales stamp with a mute lozenge cancel from Reunion.
for a discription of the 20c reprint identification:


https://6c8f2923-e15e-4a72-9a26-9c7...3dd32df2.pdf
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Edited by perf12 - 11/27/2020 10:22 am
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Posted 11/27/2020   3:07 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Bobby De La Rue to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks perf12 for the information
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United States
912 Posts
Posted 11/27/2020   7:22 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rgstamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Yes good info. Tough deciphering French but pics helpful. Thanks
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