German States - Searching For The Real Thing.

Hopefully, this post will generate a few opinions on the stamps shown.

I am a general World Collector at heart. As such, I buy collections and large lots almost exclusively. In an elderly collection that I have been combing through, there was a selection of German States and Italian States, more of the latter in a future post. I always make the assumption that stamps of this period and/or postmarks are not genuine and do most of my research trying to prove that this is a false assumption. I seldom succeed.

Sometimes, as in my first pair of pictures, the visually lovely example from Saxony has even been marked at an earlier date as counterfeit. It would be nice to know who exactly was my benefactor with this stamp but I probably never will. In other cases, It is more difficult.

This stamp from Lubeck appears genuine. It has the correct watermarked paper and this is the primary reason that I think it may be real.

The stamp from Hanover also appears genuine. It has two things I cannot account for though. First is the single line partial word or place name on the front. The second is that the stamp itself is attached to some extremely flimsy paper with writing visible on it. Not an envelope which would usually be heavier paper. Perhaps the stamp was thinned and repaired? Hard to say.

All opinions and comments are welcome.

Many stamps in this period were not on envelopes but on sheet paper which was folded into an envelope form.The writing is part of the written letter on the sheet.
The blue cancel is a town name.
IMO the Lubeck stamp is genuine.The dots are in the right places as well as the (dot pairs).The other lines are conform.

Hi Backroads
Welcome to my world. I collect and sell Germany. Try a strong light source to ferret out repaired/reinforced thins. Blue cancel likely to be Dortmund on the Hanover. The Lubeck looks good - but not really worth enough to get expertized.

Good luck
Rich

For the Hannover stamp, the only cancellation I can find that matches is GRUND. According to Hans Grobe's Spezial-Katalog und Handbook edition 5, it was used "1863/64", blue ink only. Premium is 250 DM.

Hello backroads

The german word "replik" on the back of the saxony stamp means: Replica (i.e. reproduction).

Best regards
André

Thank you to all for giving me a few more insights into the history of what I have here. It is a fascinating area to begin sorting through. The cancel on the Hanover sounds interesting. Most of the line name ones that I have run across are boxed so I was not certain that it was a legit cancel. And the "replik" backstamps seems to be fairly common as I have two or three other examples of the exact same thing on other stamps even in the very small grouping that I have in my collection. Perhaps a specific stamp dealer could be linked to it. Another thing to tweak my interest.

A very interesting and challenging area. Thanks for sharing. From my limited experience it is my impression that you have a higher chance of having the real deal with the German states compared to the Italian states

funcitypapa I think you are perfectly correct there. It is particularly difficult in both areas when you have no identified examples to go by and make comparisons. Catalog descriptions are pretty generic and a reference copy is almost always needed to be sort of sure. Prices are high for both areas and someone like me has to rely on the few examples, usually pretty tatty, that crop up in collection or large lots that come my way.