Acquired Pre-Cancelled Collection - Questions

I recently obtained a large collection of pre-canceled stamps, primarily US. I'd like to get a bit of information on collecting these stamps. Is there a place where I can contact another collector and pick their brain? Thank you in advance.

Try www.precancels,com


Peter

How many is "a large collection?" Just asking because I am finally getting around to my precancels and perfins. I have them all sorted, but it seems like a monumental task.

If one is discussing a large collection, three factors not directly related are first the number of precancels on one stamp design or set (I have 95% of possible for 899-901, Defense Issue), how many stamp designs for which I have precancels (I have at least one precancel example on 1000 different stamps) and lastly I have "San Francisco" reading up and "San Francisco" reading down on how many different stamp designs ( I have 95% of all "San Francisco"). Each can produce its own version of a large collection.

Of course there are some very rare precancels as well as some very expensive precancels and the two are not always the same. Those are the ones which prevent most folks from saying I have a complete collection of....[For example there can be only one complete set of 397-404 (1913 Panama-Pacific set for 1915 PPIE) with "San Francisco" reading up and reading down. We mere mortals can have only 17 of the 18 possible.]

Of course so far in this thread there is no mention of type(s) of precancels to which you are referring. Types can multiply or restrict numbers greatly.

I am happy to correspond about precancels, once was president of the PSS

I real have not got into precancel stamps yet. I have about 25,000 maybe 30,000 precancel stamps. One thing I will ask. I have some stamps that are precanceled but have full gum on reverse of stamp. They were never affixed. Are those stamps unused , mint, used or what would you call them.

I have been putting back precancel stamps for a long time. I have them separated by state so far. Most are pre 1940 about 70 to 75 percent the remaining 25 to 30 percent are pre 1980.

To me this is a large accumulation and very tine consuming task for to to go threw. I see a lot of people enjoying this part of the hobby. That is why I have been putting them back for so long.

A precancel stamp is by definition a used stamps as it has been cancelled even if never proving postage was paid on a piece of mail. At one time it was normal and customary to soak the gum off.

I would never soak off the gum from a precancel. That would be altering the stamp from its original state. The question is are they a term used in the hobby used for a precancel that has never been affixed?

I suspect the terminology varies from place to place. You'll find that mint French pre-cancelled stamps are priced as such in catalogues, for instance. But they're a different animal to the type used in the US.

What definition? Whose definition?
"Used" should only be used for postally used stamps, that is, the stamp was applied on a cover and marked by a cancellation or a marker monkey.
A mint postage stamp, a mint overprinted stamp, a mint perfin, or a mint precanceled stamp, are all stamps that didn't serve their postal purposes.
The only exceptions I see are CTOs, which have a declared purpose of serving collectors and not postage usage.

This is a thread in US Philately which is generally organized by Scott Catalog and as such precanceled stamps are considered used, with or without gum. Precanceled stamp are NOT intended to be cancel as they have already been canceled by the precancel. The nomenclature has been in place for nearly 18 decades (180 years). And the premier precancel society continues to publish a precancel journal with was first published in 1919.

You, Rob Roy, are too late to the party for your views to be considered regarding precancel nomenclature. I don't usually make a reference to Wikipedia, but here seem appropriate. Start here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Precancel to learn about precancels and precancel use in the world.

Now should Israel begin to issue (precanceled) stamps to be used by mass mailers, who can save the postal system time and effort by prearranging to use the precancels, and delivering the stamped mail ready for sorting, feel free to report how such items are specified in an Israel Specialized Catalog.

Collecting is not fixed nor consistent throughout the world otherwise what ever we, the USA, issues as "precanceled" would be referred to as the term for such items of a British Colony assuming the British Royal Postal System issued precanceled stamps..

The USA does not issue CTO stamps and a CTO is a far different beast than a precanceled stamp. Precancel stamp can be affixed to mail to pay postage on the item, CTO cannot. As to other countries, they may define precanceled stamps as they wish.




There is a term, it is precanceled stamp without regard to the gum state. Additionally just because a precanceled stamp has gum, it does not mean it has not been used. Bulk transactions can involve blocks of stamps which are not affixed to a sheet of paper in their entirety. Now there are those collectors who collect precanceled stamps on cover and further desire the precanceled stamp to be tied by a cancel or other postal marking to show actual use on the item affixed.

Sorry, I stand corrected.

Although the OP wanted to ask a more general question
Which, in my basic foreigner's English, translates to "American and ww precanceled".

If my views are not to be considered, there's really not much reason for you to pay attention to them.

The question as to if the precancel stamps are to be considered as "used" was settled long before you or I were born. What we as an individual wish to define such items will not have impact on what has been built in this subject area. It would be similar to saying who named the number "6," why did they have that right and I think the word for "6" should be "lemon." Nice idea, perhaps, but one that will be quickly ignored.

If you did look at the Wikipedia link, you will see precanceled stamps are not that common to other countries. The vast majority of countries do not have them.

Philately, as with life, has a constant chance to learn and learn more.

Like Rob Roy, I refer you to the word "primarily", hence my earlier reply. I look forward to delving into the world of "the British Royal Postal System", however.

Parcelpostguy points out that "precancanceled stamps are considered used, with or without gum", this is not completely accurate. The Scott U.S. Specialized catalogue does make the distinction that some U.S. precanceled stamps with full original gum are much more valuable than the same stamps without gum.

As a case in point are the precanceled coil stamps of the Prominent Americans Issue. A 6¢ Franklin Roosevelt horizontal coil joint line pair (Scott 1305, in mint never hinged condition) is valued at $675 (2022 Scott) while the same pair used and without gum is valued (depending on the precanceled city) between 50¢ and $2 (PSS April 2020 Catalog of United States Bureau Precancels, with a 5x premium for a line pair and one outlier from Rock Hill, S.C. being worth much more).

Another example is the 15¢ Oliver Wendell Holmes coil joint line pair (Scott 1305E, Bureau precanceled "Chicago, IL", in mint never hinged condition) valued at $1,100 while the same pair used and without gum is valued at $30 (again, PSS April 2020 Catalog of United States Bureau Precancels, with a 5x premium for a line pair).

There are other examples in Scott that follow the same pricing paradigm. Footnotes under the entries for Scott 1056 and 1058 (Liberty Issue, the 4¢ Abraham Lincoln coil) states that "It was against postal refulations to make mint precanceled examples of No. 1058b available other than to permit holders for their use. Resale was prohibited since some mint examples do exist in the marketplace, values are furnished here."

Don't believe when naysayers tell you that "it's settled science" when the prudent thing to do is dig deeper to expand your knowledge.

"Philately, as with life, has a constant chance to learn and learn more."

Walkman82. Thank you, so the value for precancel stamps with full gum never affixed can be much higher than those used with out gum. But are there a term used for that unused never affixed full gum stamp? Would you call it a mint precancel OG?