Acquired Pre-Cancelled Collection - Questions

It seems I will need to pay more attention when it comes to precancel stamps. I will have to take the time to go threw my stamps (25,000 to 30,000 + stamps). I may find a goodie in all that stuff. I never was much into precancel stamp. After hearing this a doing a little research on my own. I will have to start paying more attention to this field of the hobby.

Point noted. But....

Not to put too fine of point on it, my general statement is accurate to approximately .9999834%. Yes there are exceptions to most anything, for example if asked, most folks will say, yes the sun will rise tomorrow; yet that is wrong as it will not rise tomorrow in many places and as such saying yes is less accurate than my statement of precancels but few would tolerate a discussion of the exceptions.

That said, Scott (2022 Specialized page 36A) indicates some 600,000 different precancels from 20,000 post offices. Scott continues with, "precancels are listed in the catalog only if the precanceled stamp is different from the nonprecanceled version...or, if the stamp only exists precanceled. Classic locals and experimental Bureaus are also included as cancellations."

Scott defines "Cancellation" (Page 35A) as "postal marking which make further use of stamps impossible. As used in the listing of this catalog, cancellations include both postmarks used as cancellations and obliterations primarily to cancel (or 'kill') the stamp." Precancels are such obliterations.

Now here is a question for you: How many days in a year? The only correct answer, but inaccurate answer is 365, all years have 365. Now some years have more but explaining which years takes many words, especially when one needs to include the explanation of what is and is not a leap year. That said most folks will not blink with the answer of just 365, yet that answer, as accepted as it maybe is 75.75% correct. As there are only 97 leap years in a 400 year period because while all centuries have 24 leap years, only centuries when the last year of the century is divisible by 400 is it a leap year. Example the year 2000, the last year of the 20th century, was a leap year.

> But are there a term used for that unused never affixed full gum stamp?
> Would you call it a mint precancel OG?
How about simply "full gum precancel".
It seems clear and descriptive.

"Mint" does not work because of the cancel.
"Unused" can't be easily proven.
"OG" seems to usually imply "partial gum", which is not what you are trying to describe.

You forgot to add hinging to the mix, yosclimber. While the recent Scott listing for the untagged precanceled stamps appear after the declaration all following prices are for MNH stamps, what adjustments would be made or should be made for these goodies?

The Philatelic Foundation defines OG thus, "Original Gum Gum which is in the original state as applied by the printer." This is generally consistent with all expert services.

Good point, and thank you for the definition of OG.
So it would appear that OG always implies NH?

Climber - original gum simply means it's the gum originally added to the stamp by the issuing country. Stamps are often described as "part original gum" or "large part original gum" in descriptions. Full original gum is the same as never hinged.

The degree of original gum remaining is not only affected by hinging as other factors can reduce the amount of original gum remaining on a stamp, for example if the stamp had become adhered to an album page or mount.

And of course, regummed stamps no longer have original gum, as do mint stamps where the collector has soaked off the gum to preserve the stamp.

I ended up buying this Precancel collection.
Most of the collection was Bureau precancels on manila stock pages by State.
Although they were sorted by year on the state page, rather than by town.
There was also a nice copy of the 1950 Mitchell-Hoover Catalog of US Bureau Precancels.

The collection included a page of plate number singles, which are of course a little more scarce.

In the process I had fun learning about Precancels.
I started by looking through my dups and putting the precancels into stock pages (by year).
This made a decent page for each of the 3 main Regular issue series (1922, 1938, 1954).

I looked at some of the ebay Sold items.
The market seems to be fairly active, especially some of the State collections
on printed album pages.
So there must be collectors out there trying to complete State collections.

I downloaded a copy of the PSS Style Chart PDF from precancels.com .
I can see this is an extension of the styles in the Mitchell-Hoover catalog.
I don't know if I'll do more precancel related purchases, but it is at least something to do with all the dups!
It does seem like an area of collecting where US collectors can go if
their regular collection is mostly complete, and they don't want to go for
the very expensive stamps.
Although there are some rare precancels that are expensive as well.

Happy to help if I can. Been collecting stamps for nearly 60 years and specializing in precancels for 12 or so.

Parcelpostguy:

Point noted. But....

Not to put too fine of point on it, my general statement is accurate to approximately .9999834%.

I presume you meant 99.99834%. Otherwise your statement is accurate to less than 1%.

While I am in no way implying that the quote above doesn't exist somewhere within the various documents and definitions attributable to the Philatelic Foundation, the quoted definition above cannot be found on the Philatelic Foundation website page regarding regumming. There are many mentions of "original gum" on this page, but not the exact one quote above.

https://www.philatelicfoundation.or...en-regummed/

There is no mention of "printer" on this page. PF does though mention a distinction between original gum and MNH in this short passage:

"The term "original gum" is used universally by dealers and collectors alike. It refers to the adhesive on the back of a postage stamp, intended to attach the stamp to a letter or parcel when moistened. On an unused stamp, when this gum remains the stamp is described as having original gum. The optimum condition for this gum is to be in exactly the same state as it was in when it left the post office. This is referred to as "mint, never hinged". "

Since they define both, PF makes a distinction between original gum in more than one state. Again, the quote above may exist elsewhere within PF materials that I cannot see (and I own no PF certs).

It perhaps also should be mentioned that Stanley Gibbons differentiates between "original gum" and "FULL original gum" both in it's certs and it's catalogs. In a SG cert (and this is also true of BPA and Murray Payne certs), original gum simply means that the gum remaining on the stamp is original (but some may be missing), and full original gum means MNH.

Perhaps PF offers conflicting definitions for original gum?

So, some people can get to use "used" stamps. Weird - on page XVll of the 2020 Bureau Precancel Catalog, there is this: "The 4¢ Lincoln coil stamp in wet printed form exists only as a bureau precancel, making it sought by collectors of U.S. varieties. It is known from 17 cities. Because unused precancels were not available to collectors when this stamp was current, mint examples command a substantial premium."
Hmmm - "used mint" stamps - what a concept. The "Shanghai overprints" were for use only by authorized mailers in Shanghai - were they all considered "used" elsewhere? To me, there's a difference between "canceled before use" and "used". That's my 2 cents worth - I've read all the other comments defending the convention of calling them used, but hey, they're legal to own with full original gum nowadays . . .

I believe that the majority of those precancel collectors that would care to know about the gum condition or gum type as "minted" describe them as "precanceled, full original gum, never hinged". I describe them as "precanceled, mint, never hinged" or "precanceled, M, NH" for short. For "specialists", gum often matters. As an example, Scott #1618 with the "national", "lines only" precancel can be found with "shiny" and "dull" gum types - you can find a "shiny" gum pair selling for around $6.00 and the "dull" gum pair selling for around $140.00. You can find them used (no gum) for around $1.00 a pair.

Not to throw a wrench in, but there is also the fact that some small town postmasters and some contracted in store type post offices, often had clerks who were more than willing for a free meal say, to precancel any stamp desired, upon demand. I have a wide range of such, precancelled with a KY town on a wide range of mid 1970 commemoratives and airmails, including inverted, sideways, etc. courtesy of the contract office postmaster. Of course, all completely unauthorized and bogus.

To explain what I post here about "precancels", here's a little about how I collect them the way I do. I collect STAMPS. I'm trying to make a "specialized collection" of on particular series of U.S. stamps, some of which have been "precanceled". Now, here we go : the Bureau of Engraving stipulated that to have a particular stamp in this series "precanceled" the "authorized mailer(s)" in that city had to order a minimum of 250,000 stamps to be "precanceled". If that "authorized mailer" in that city only actually used 249,000 of those stamps ON MAIL, what descriptive would you term the other remaining 1,000 stamps ? "USED"? Who USED them? To me, they are just as the Bureau printed them - "mint, canceled before use". To me, because they were "overprinted" by the BEP as the stamps were being produced, each different city or style of that "overprint" makes a different "face different" variety of the basic stamp. That's how I collect them - as face different varieties. As I said, I collect stamps, and I prefer to collect stamps AS THEY WERE PRODUCED - that means that if they were produced with gum, that's how I prefer to collect them (if possible). I imagine that I am not alone as to being willing to pay a reasonable premium to acquire a "full original gum, never hinged" specimen. This is how I describe the ones in my collection : (1)Mint, full original gum; (2)unused, disturbed gum (full gum, but hinged or "whatever"); and (3)used, no gum ("possibly used/possibly "washed") and (4)used, on cover. That's the "how and why" I collect as I do - everybody can collect as they choose to and call a stamp used if it has or hasn't fulfilled the definition of of the word. There are a few in my collection that have never been found "not used" . . .

having read threw this post....i have read the part about the ...

[ the sun will rise tomorrow; yet that is wrong as it will not rise tomorrow in some places....]

hmmm no mater how you read that... ( about the sun ) as with stamps ...

one has to look a little closer at the wording and the interpitation of the understanding of what it is.....

the sun does not rise or set.....the earth rotates into the sun and away from the sun....thus is the same with stamps