Stamp Community Family of Web Sites
Thousands of stamps, consistently graded, competitively priced and hundreds of in-depth blog posts to read








Stamp Community Forum
 
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

This page may contain links that result in small commissions to keep this free site up and running.

Welcome Guest! Registering and/or logging in will remove the anchor (bottom) ads. It's Free!

What Does The Description "Sound" Mean?

Previous Page | Next Page    
 
To participate in the forum you must log in or register.
Author Previous TopicReplies: 39 / Views: 2,686Next Topic
Page: of 3
Pillar Of The Community
United States
6430 Posts
Posted 09/27/2023   8:56 pm  Show Profile Check revenuecollector's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add revenuecollector to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
All my opinions, but...

Things that DO cause a stamp to be considered not sound:

Tears
Thins
Scrapes/scuffs
Creases
Short perfs
Pulled perfs
Trimming
Stains
Soiling
Color change due to chemical/environmental exposure
Repairs
Altering the design (e.g., drawing in parts of the design)
Adding margins
Adding backing
Reperforating
Regumming
Removal of a cancel or lightening a cancel

Things that do NOT (IMO) cause a stamp to be considered not sound:

Heavy cancels
Natural straight edges
Removal of gum from a mint stamp (the stamp is now considered to be MNG or "unused" but that does not make the stamp unsound)
Paper inclusions
Printing anomalies (over- or -underinked, doubling, etc.)
Paper anomalies (foldovers, preprint paper folds, doubled papers)
Misplaced overprints
Misperfs

Some of these may negatively impact value or marketability, but they do not make a stamp unsound.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Valued Member
United States
175 Posts
Posted 09/27/2023   10:57 pm  Show Profile Check philatelia7's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add philatelia7 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Parcelpost guy - regarding your comment " You wasted your time asking the question here when the responses do not matter. You need to direct that question to the person or firm using it".

I thank you for your admonition, but I fear that you are mistaken or are making an unfounded assumption - the question was not asked to clarify how some hypothetical "person or firm" might be using the term. I asked this question to better understand how I, myself, might best apply the term to material I wish to sell and how that usage would be interpreted by the majority of the philatelic community if they were to read my lot description. The responses from these knowledgeable folks has really helped me to better understand the subtle nuances this term conveys. Gotta learn the lingo, eh?
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Edited by philatelia7 - 09/27/2023 10:58 pm
Bedrock Of The Community
12552 Posts
Posted 09/28/2023   12:16 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rogdcam to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
In the auction description world their are two polar terms used for material in larger lots, sound and mixed condition. Mixed condition is always the safer of the two because it is difficult to get in trouble using it.

Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United Kingdom
8578 Posts
Posted 09/28/2023   12:49 am  Show Profile Check GeoffHa's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add GeoffHa to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I fear that "mixed" has rather become a synonym for "largely poor".
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
Learn More...
United States
1055 Posts
Posted 09/28/2023   02:35 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add ZebraMan to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Ever buy a collection that was from an ex-smoker. That stuff should be classified as hazardous waste. (not sound)

* And I doubt that will ever come up in the description.

Agreed. Here is some truth in advertising from the next Sparks auction (sale 48 lot 944). 100 Worldwide Covers "Online photos show an overview of this eclectic lot. We note a few of the covers have faults including corner bends and tears, along with a faint musty odor. Overall fine to very fine."
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Bedrock Of The Community
12552 Posts
Posted 09/28/2023   07:41 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rogdcam to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Rasdale also uses descriptive terms such as musty and odor liberally as applicable. Since smell can be as subjective as taste I wonder just how bad the smell is sometimes.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United States
6430 Posts
Posted 09/28/2023   08:42 am  Show Profile Check revenuecollector's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add revenuecollector to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
"This adventurous lot appears to have been stored in close proximity with livestock and thus exhibits fecally-tinged charactersistics to its aroma."

tl;dr: Smells like sh*t.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Valued Member
United States
175 Posts
Posted 09/28/2023   09:24 am  Show Profile Check philatelia7's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add philatelia7 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
A few musty smelling 1990s first day covers were in a box lot I recently purchased. After an hour in the intense high noon Florida sun the smell was almost completely gone. That wouldn't be easy to do with stamps but worked great on those nasty covers.

Cigarette smoke and musty smells are bad, but I swear a recent purchase was worse. Smelled like it was stored in the litter box - whew - reeked of cat. Ewwwww. My two schnauzers kept giving the box dirty looks.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Edited by philatelia7 - 09/28/2023 09:26 am
Pillar Of The Community
United States
1115 Posts
Posted 09/28/2023   11:18 am  Show Profile Check docgfd's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add docgfd to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I asked this question to better understand how I, myself, might best apply the term to material I wish to sell and how that usage would be interpreted by the majority of the philatelic community if they were to read my lot description.


Another way to approach this and thereby avoiding a somewhat nebulous term, might be the use of 'pertinent negatives' in your descriptions, such as 'no tears,' 'no creases,' or 'no obvious faults.'
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United States
4276 Posts
Posted 09/28/2023   5:21 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Parcelpostguy to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Parcelpost guy - regarding your comment " You wasted your time asking the question here when the responses do not matter. You need to direct that question to the person or firm using it".

I thank you for your admonition, but I fear that you are mistaken or are making an unfounded assumption - the question was not asked to clarify how some hypothetical "person or firm" might be using the term. I asked this question to better understand how I, myself, might best apply the term to material I wish to sell and how that usage would be interpreted by the majority of the philatelic community if they were to read my lot description. The responses from these knowledgeable folks has really helped me to better understand the subtle nuances this term conveys. Gotta learn the lingo, eh?


Sound is a "term of art" (this you can look up in any dictionary or the OED). The fact you referenced a general dictionary definition for sound shows you are clueless about terms of art as such are not used in the manner of the normal definition. You want legal terms of art, you need a dictionary of legal terms.

Again, it matters not what others mean when they say "sound" it only matters what you mean when you use "sound" and then you are responsible for how it is defined. Likewise it is important to determine if your "sound" matches another's "sound" when considering a stamp purchase.

Me, for now, how about if I define a "sound" stamp as all stamps issued for which music or other noises can be played from the stamp. That said, I will not clutter this thread with images of my "sound" topical (think but do not limit yourself to Bhutan). Yet no one, none at all, gave that reasonable definition of a "sound stamp." So I ask you, do you have any of my sound stamps?

So, in summary, go with the "crowd." Now what does that mean? It means I picked a word for which the definitions do not allow for a clear inference of meaning. But since the subject is "sound" I may likely mean the instrument but, it also comes with a nautical based term of art which resembles an idiom.

Can a sound stamp be altered? Well, no one said yes above, but if that is the accepted definition for a sound stamp, as in meaning "unaltered from manner of intended issue," what do you call a Farley issue stamp issued without gum (NGAI) which has had gum added? Is that still sound?

Edited for spelling and punctuation.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Edited by Parcelpostguy - 09/28/2023 5:29 pm
Pillar Of The Community
United States
6430 Posts
Posted 09/28/2023   6:52 pm  Show Profile Check revenuecollector's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add revenuecollector to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
...if that is the accepted definition for a sound stamp, as in meaning "unaltered from manner of intended issue,"...


I disagree with that definition. If that is the agreed upon definition, then all vending machine coils, sewing machine perfs, and bisects, amongst other items, by definition can never be sound.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Bedrock Of The Community
12552 Posts
Posted 09/28/2023   6:58 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rogdcam to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Where's my horse whip.....
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United States
4079 Posts
Posted 09/28/2023   7:37 pm  Show Profile Check eyeonwall's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add eyeonwall to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I agree with recenuecollector's last 2 posts (if he made another one earlier, I am not saying I don't agree with that)
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Bedrock Of The Community
12552 Posts
Posted 09/28/2023   7:54 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rogdcam to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Ditto
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Pillar Of The Community
United States
2830 Posts
Posted 09/28/2023   8:09 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add shermae to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I agree with everything Revenuecollector identified as attributes of sound and "unsound" stamps, with one exception. Occasionally, a paper inclusion can either be large enough or dark enough to make the stamp unappealing and less valuable. Does this mean that the stamp isn't "sound?" Probably not, but it definitely reduces the value if the paper inclusion is ugly enough.
Send note to Staff  Go to Top of Page
Page: of 3 Previous TopicReplies: 39 / Views: 2,686Next Topic  
Previous Page | Next Page
 
To participate in the forum you must log in or register.

Go to Top of Page

Disclaimer: While a tremendous amount of effort goes into ensuring the accuracy of the information contained in this site, Stamp Community assumes no liability for errors. Copyright 2005 - 2026 Stamp Community Family - All rights reserved worldwide. Use of any images or content on this website without prior written permission of Stamp Community or the original lender is strictly prohibited.
Privacy Policy / Terms of Use    Advertise Here
Stamp Community Forum © 2007 - 2026 Stamp Community Forums
It took 0.23 seconds to lick this stamp. Powered By: Snitz Forums 2000 Version 3.4.05