China: An Out Of The Question Fake

Here is a similar cover, genuine this time, from 1968. With a very common stamp, like the one that probably was attached to this cover before some guy (or girl, you never know) put everything aside to make a very profitable forgery.

Liu Wenjie's sex collective was located just outside the Xihua Gate (West Glorious Gate) of the Forbidden City. Bold choice.

ICYMI, Near the top of the CDS in flip138's last picture, it looks like there is some residue of perforations from a stamp that could have been torn off the original cover.

A genuine example sold by Siegel:

"During 1984-5 I was buying in Hong Kong damaged examples of PRC's 1968 "Whole China is Red" (Scott 999A), all postally used, at prices ranging from $150-$250 each. I believe I handled 11 or 12 of them. Netted a $100 profit each selling them damaged."

Quote from https://www.michaelrogersinc.com/history4.htm

Flightle Bee: Interesting story! If genuine, where are those 11, 12 stamps nowadays? The fact they were damaged, could be an indicator they indeed were genuine. Why would someone take all the trouble to make a forgery of a damaged stamp, you could ask... but then again, in the world of Chinese forgeries anything is possible. Even a damaged one would bring in a lot of money these days: the filler every collector of Chinese stamps dreams of...

Tigre584- his firm, Kelleher and Rogers sold a mint, never hinged example at a Hong Kong auction (sale no. 37, couldn't find a date) with BPA certificate. On the listing they stated "The stamp was officially issued on November 25. Inaccuracies in the map were noticed almost immediately, including the omission of the Xisha and Nanshi Archipelagos, and the entire issue was withdrawn from sale on November 26. However, some post offices had begun selling the stamp on November 24, prior to its day of issue, and these have since found their way to market."

The price realised was about 78,000 euros.

Xisha and Nanshi islands are flyspecks; wouldn't be visible on this stamp at all, and the former would be hidden by the flags. Odd…

The omission of those tiny islands was not the real reason. It was leaving the island of Taiwan white instead of red, thereby implying Taiwan was not a part of the P.R. of China. A huge mistake and a great embarrasment to the Chinese authorities. How could so many people not notice this mistake? They really could not admit this to have happened, so they threw in the omission of those islets, and also the wrong drawing of some borders. The designer of this stamp is said to have been very worried after this dramatic event surrounding his stamp and feared for imprisonement or even worse... There have been more of these design-faults that were only discovered after stamps were issued, and you may wonder if this was the result of the austere circumstances under communist rule: Who dared point out to authorities they made a mistake? And so very rare stamps were created that make big bucks in the capitalist world. Pure irony!

With my limited knowledge of the Chinese language, and from the last line of Chinese characters, it seems that the sender was from the city of Wuhan?

Is so, then was the letter sent from Wuhan? But the postmark on the stamp showed Peking. But if the letter was sent locally within Peking, why was there the blue airmail label to the left of the stamp?

And from here ---> https://www.chinastampsociety.org/f...able-PRC.pdf, the domestic local letter rate was 4c. This stamp is denominated 8c, which was the domestic distant letter rate, unless this letter was heavy and crossed into the second weight step domestic local letter rate.

Also, let's look at some of the seller's sold items...

I feel like Philip Ryle is back in action or a surrogate.

It has an air-mail label. So, you should take any air-mail supplement into consideration.

A very interesting thread, Tigre, that adds to my knowledge of a well-known rare PRC stamp, so this is exactly the kind of thing this forum should be best at.

And I'll add this not about stamps but about ordinary manners -- the phrasing we use in our comments can sometimes convey irritation in a condescending way. We've probably all made this mistake, and I know I have. Bluntness often comes across as dismissive rudeness -- even if not intended that way. There's a big difference between "This is useless" (which it might very well be) and "To make this more useful, consider doing this . . . . "

Fortunately most comments on this forum are considerate of others or it wouldn't last long!

Are there any characteristics that identify the stamp on the cover as a forgery?

Looking at the "real" stamp posted above by rogdcam, I am tempted to state the one on the cover is an improvement on that. Still, unless I am mistaken, the only argument provided so far is it having been used.

Since one appears to be a photograph and the Siegel one, likely, is a scan, what appears to be and what is may be two different things.

Edit: Yes, the price at which it was sold is suspect.

Those stamps with inverted centers... To my knowledge, only the 2 dollar is known with that error, and very rare and valuable at that. He's even selling a 20 dollar-one, and earned a lot of money for a non-existing stamp (it's not even a filler!). ''And many of the very rare ''stamps'' he is selling have the same strange smudgy look as our now infamous Whole country is red. Would be nice to know where all these forgeries were made. Are they old or just the product of a recent forgerer?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the perforations of the stamp on the cover does not line up with the perforations of the stamp sold by Siegel?