A US No 5 Rare Variety Going Crazy On Ebay

Yes you can JamJim, end it early, but the seller seams to be honouring his early bidders.

BeeSee, it is a Scott 7 Type II. It is position 71L1E double transfer one inverted. Same plate as the #5 but not nearly a valuable ($1550 vs $70,000).

Russ, I asked because I am no expert in early U.S. and your avatar looks nicer.

I bought a group of 10 Scott 7 from a "respected and knowlegable" dealer for $400. When I checked them I found 8 were regular #7's one #8 (Type III) and the double transfer stamp (my avatar). The # 8 value is $3250. That really shows the confusion on the 1851 1 cent.

If I read this thread right does it mean that someone is going to pay over $13,000 for a stamp that is actually Scott#7 Type II, CV $1550?

Over 1,000 views Now!

JimJim, I will let Russ explain :)

jimjam, No the $1550 value is the stamp in my avatar. The stamp on ebay is in all appearances a Type I (Scott 5) with a value of $70,000. The top design is complete and the bottom, although cut close, shows to be complete. The lower ornaments are complete and fully transferred. I am sure that it will be expertized as a Scott 5.
Edit: The 1851-57 1 cent is my all time favorite stamps. The stamp in question is the most desirable of all the types.

Thanks for the info, Russ.

I must say that I'm finding this all very educational!

However, I'm having trouble understanding why any stamp issued in such a large country as the US can only exist in 98 known examples.

Was it a very short print run? If so, why?

jimjam, Where to start on this stamp. I will keep it as simple as possible. The first plate (plate 1) was entered in positions 10R-1R (roll A, single relief). The entries were erased and re-entered 10R-3R (roll A) with the design rolling out the row below. The plate was rejected and a new transfer roll was made. The rejected plate was rotated 180 degrees and 3 positions were entered (10R, 20R and 30R) to test the new transfer roll (roll B, 3 relief ). The roll B was rejected and a trimmed design roll (roll C, 3 relief) was made. The A new plate was started and was abandoned after catastrophic failure.

Plate 1 was brought back, the 3 test entries were erased. Position 3R-10R were left since they had already been erased once. The new trimmed roll C was used to enter the remaining 192 positions.

The positions 3R1E through 10R1E are the only positions made with roll A, the complete design transfer roll all other were made with roll C the trimmed design. Additionally, the 3 test positions now become 71L1E, 81L1E and 91L1E the inverted transfer positions from the 180 degree rotation.

The positions 3R1E through 6R1E and 9R1E are Type Ib (the only 5 positions of this type), 7R1E is Type I (the only position of this type).
As I stated earlier, this is the most intriguing and complex issue in U.S. stamps.
Edit: Correct invert position numbers.

Russ that's a very precise and thorough explanation but I
still don't know what features differentiates a 7R1E from a 71L1E.

Those stamps are just too complicated for me. Interesting yes but
not my cup of tea.

litho, 7R1E 7 is the position in the plate. Since the panes were 10x10 it was top row seventh stamp. R is right pane (L would be left) 1 is plate number and E is for Early. (Plate 1E was re-entered and recut to become plate 1L or Plate 1 Late)

OK, but what feature(s) about the stamp in question indicate that it
is from that plate position?

You wrote previously:



But without pics I still can't picture it.

what a great thing to do, not end the auction, not change the price.

But what great advertising for himself and ebay also. ebay should be paying him for the free advertising.

People will look and see for a while to see if he lists anything else incorrectly. He probably won't, but just to have that many people looking at your listings is more than half the battle won, as the ebay advertising on top of this forum shows.

Nice guy. But smart too. I like him. Good luck to all the bidders!

1. The stamp is a T relief from transfer roll A with full design.
2. Stamp has full transfer at top showing complete design.
3. Stamp has full transfer at bottom without roll out. (Position 17R1E was short transferred. If it wasn't short transferred it would have rolled out the bottom of the stamp above and removed part of the bottom features making it a Type Ib)
The only stamp that meets all 3 of these criteria is 7R1E.
When I first started to study the 1851 1 cent I became total intrigued with it. I have spent several hundred hours studying this issue. No other stamp in U.S. philately compares to this issue. This is by far the hardest issue to master. People often talk about the Washington-Franklins of 1908-1922, they are simple in comparison to these. I have seen more misidentified stamps on this issue than on any other. It also has the largest number of double transfers and the most prominent plate crack on any U.S. issue.