Help With 2c Washington

I know there are other posts on this, and I think I've read them all. I have poured over the descriptions in my 2012 US Scott Specialized. But I still can't completely ID these three stamps. All are watermarked 191, but on the Second Stamp it is barely visible. The first looks like an A88 Type III and the last two A88 Type IV's. Am I right? I've noticed the following:
First stamp: fewer dots on ear, shorter hairline, well-defined inner oval, line in scroll work just below the "U", better defined lines on sleeve
Second stamp: more dots on ear, not as well defined line in scroll work just below the "U"
Third stamp: more dots on ear, extra hairline, very litte line in scroll work just below the "U", less-defined lines on sleeve

Are the lines that may go through the triangle border fairly distinctive? I can see something there but not much.

As hard as I try, I cannot see any difference in the toga buttons, or the T in TWO or the lines into the oval by the U.

Check for the upper triangles and the horizontal lines. Don't have a catalog in front of me but they all appear to be the same type ? Perhaps different shades but from a quick glance the same type.

I agree that they are first image Type III, last 2 images TypeIV. There are 21 differences between BEP die 79 (used for Type II and Type III rolls) and BEP die 83 (used for Type IV rolls).

Thanks for the quick response on a repeated topic.

I assume the 21 differences are listed somewhere. I don't see them in Scott Specialized. Where can I find them?

This is an gray scale image of the 3rd stamp subtracted from the 1st using Paint.NET. If you ignore the cancellations, which show up as bright areas, most of the rest of the stamp is dark or close to it. I'm not sure, but I think they may be the same.

If you have pictures of the stamps you know are correctly identified, you can use this method to spot the differences and see whether they matched.

Another option is try the 1847usa site. They have a very nice page on the differences between the types.

(I can't post a link as I don't have enough posts).

A little historical background on the Type III and Type IV may be helpful.

The BEP created die 79 which was used for making all 33 Type II and Type III transfer rolls. Since each transfer roll had 6 reliefs that means that die 79 had a minimum of 198 impressions taken (33 X 6). The die 79 was evidently no longer usable for transfer roll production.

The BEP used the Type III transfer roll No 151 to laydown the new die 83 (the Type IV die). After the die laydown the line had to be strengthened by recutting. This recutting is where the 21 differences came from.

The 3 main differences are the strengthening of the hairlines, the overcutting of the portrait shading lines by the "U" and the straightening of the inboard leg of the "T".

With the fiirst image posted by Leo the cancel covers the main hairline and the resolution does not clearly show the recut shading lines by the "U". Bur the "T" is definitely Type III. Below is the images of the first and second stamps posted. The stamp on the left is Type III and the stamp on the right is Type IV. I have placed an arrow in each to show the difference in the curve of the "T". The Type III has a greater curve while the Type IV is straighter.



In reference to the 21 differences, Hugh Southgate and George Brett published their research in the Chronicle in 1955. It is interesting to note that Scott issued the major catalog number 279B in 1999, 101 years after the stamp was issued and 44 years after the Southgate/Brett article was published.

All great information! Thanks. Russ, would it be correct to say that not all of these minute differences would be present on all Types due to inking or pressure or whatever? And, I am reading up on dies, transfer rolls, etc. to educate myself. Fascinating stuff.

These differences would be noticeable in sharp impressions. Plate wear, inking, paper moisture, impression roll pressure, etc would all affect the degree to which some of the minor difference would visible.