More Washington Questions

Like ILS, I've been going through some Washingtons and Franklins, and have questions! He's got a great thread going over there, so I don't want to convolute his train of thought with my problems.
So here we go.
I had what I thought were some 1917-19 2c Washingtons set aside with colour variations (I haven't yet broken them down to exact colours and types) but realized, that a couple were the wrong size. All are perf 11 with no discernible watermarks, but now I'm thinking a couple might be 1918-20 issues.
Look here...



Here are three stamps that I've lined up along the bottom of the design. The stamp on left is a 1916 rotary press coil. I know rotary press stamps are longer because of stretching of the image during the printing process.
The middle stamp is what I believe to be a SC499 deep rose. It is, of course shorter than the rotary press stamp. The stamp on the right is shorter still.
Is this last stamp (on the right) an offset printed stamp, setting it somewhere in the 1918-20 family? I have another which is, again different slightly in colour, but short like this one.
Confusing, no?

One of the simple checks for offset stamps is to feel the printed surface. If it feels smooth it is probably offset. Or take a piece of thin aluminum foil and press it over the stamp with your fingers. If you see an image of the stamp, it is not offset. Or careful run the edge of your fingernail over it. Rotary and flat plate presses your will detect the ridges of ink and on an offset you will not.

Thanks quigngt. I had actually read that on another thread (I do searches before asking questions, I know things get repeated) but unfortunately the foil turned up nothing on any of them.
I think my wife has been buying the higher quality aluminium wrap again! It's too thick.

The smaller stamps certainly feel softer (yes, I touched them), but my calloused finger tips aren't the the most delicate.

The right stamp is definitely an offset. The heavy shading from chin to ear and the heavy lines on the toga are dead give away. The thinner the foil the better.

The more you deal with the W/Fs the easier it gets to identify the off-set issues. They have a look thats just different from the engraved W/Fs that makes them stand out. To me, they are just aren't as bold, as sharp as engraved issues in their details.

Or just do as I do. Take all the W/F's and stuff them in a stock book and repeat to yourself 3 times "One day I will organize these" and then keep finding reasons not to follow through, works every time.

I'm starting to side with Stallzer on this one!

The one on your far right is definitely an offset. compare to the flat plate and even rotary press (intaglio)printings and they almost jump out at you as looking cartoon like and grainy in appearance.

Then again James, if you have been keeping up with my thread then your probably wiser not to take my advice this evening! hahaha...

Well it's your loss Jeff. I was sorting these and setting aside a bunch to send to you, but this thread and yours has caused me to go back to the 'cast off's' and look at them again. I've barely begun the scratch the surface. I'm afraid you may have to wait.

I agree with bill, the stamp on the right is an offset stamp. To me they look like photocopies or fakes because of their lack of detail. As others have said, the more you deal with them the more you learn. Several varieties of this issue are pretty easy (i.e. cheap) to acquire and can help your knowledge immensely when you have a known example to compare with.

Fellas, if any of you don't feel like dealing with the W/Fs, I'll gladly take them off your hands. Thats basically what I collect. My goal is Mint, Used and On-Cover examples of them. I know there are several I'll never get, but its still fun hunting them.

Take your time James. It seems like I have some time left going through these yet. PLUS- I knocked the shoebox lid over last night so back to the drawing board I guess! grrrr...

P.S.
Not to change the subject but Did you ever get that mailer yet James? That's worrying me!

No sign yet, Jeff. Not to worry. Sometimes the system works slowly.

Al. E. Gator, How complete (minus the great rarities) is your collection? I am at the point that even $100 would probably not be enough to add a single stamp. Oh well, I can enjoy what I have. Actually, I am really into the perf 10 watermarked issues (Scott 423and following?) The color varieties on the 2 cent are fascinating. I have one which almost has a salmon cast to the underlying carmine. It is a most unusual color. I also like, and have the blocks of 10 with the words COIL STAMPS in the selvage. Really like those.

Rohumpy, I've got everything either mint or used, or mint and used, and several on covers or bank tags except for the big dogs. Heres what I don't have: 356,359 thru 366(Blues),332b,388,389 (Orangeburg),416a,449,459,461,467,476A,482A,485,491,499h,505,510a,518b,519,539,544,545,546, and the compound perf. issues or varieties. I may eventually be able to find/purchase some of these but most will never be obtainable for me. I've several on-cover or bank tags but the many of the higher denominations are still needed and probably will be too expensive to get. I've only a couple of booklet panes--probably won't focus too much on them unless a really good deal pops up. I've created my own album pages using Excell, nothing fancy, its just that I want spaces to mount multiple copies, blocks, strips, color varities, etc. of any single issue. I've had an opportunity to pick up a couple of collections and box lots etc. in the past but there isn't much opportunity where I live for that. All that being said, I'm still open to anyone who wants to part with W/Fs-I still enjoy the hunt.

Dave

so I got his great idea today and experimented on a few low value washington Franklins , put them in a little Ziploc storage tub, added water a little body wash(just a dab) and then I got a great idea;I decided to use a little bit of those Efferdent crystals denture cleaning stuff. I waited a few minutes and took them out. To my horror they all turned to mush and the color got ate off of them and some of the green stamps had a yellow or bright blue appearance just under the ink's surface...Nightmare stuff!

So don't do that. Luckily everything I used was all junk anyay but I was actualy amazed at how caustic that stuff is!

LOL that's funny. Maybe Alka Seltzer would work better