90c Scott 122 Whithout Grill? Forgery?help Me

Hello forum
I have this stamp from 90c. grills, the paper is thick and white on the reverse has the rubber wood, I do not like how it sounds like a stamp reprint leave it to you experts for an answer. regards Simone

It looks like a forgery to me. Paper is wrong, no grill and the frame and vignette don't look quite right to me? If it is real, at the very least it has been (very badly) re-perforated! It just looks too crude to me for some reason?

The "paper" appears too thick for a normal 122 and many of the details appear too crude. But maybe it's an essay or proof ...

Looks like a perforated card proof.

Nothing but a facsimile or forgery. The stamp doesn't look right at first glance, but when you start comparing details to an original, it becomes obvious this isn't a real stamp. The details are too "muddy", not crisp. It looks like something printed by a copy machine.

Here's a picture of an actual 132 that's on ebay right now.

BRian

Here is the proof for comparison. Paper will be different since this is on India paper.

Hello

thx very much I found an album in 1922 but my suspicion was that it was not good to me and you confirmed.

I put it on ebay for $ 1

I would confirm what it is first.

Brian is correct. It is a forgery. But let me hasten to add that decent-appearing forgeries of this stamp are not common and collectors of forgeries would probably value this somewhere in the $50/75. range - much more than the usual poor forgeries. Many US Locals, for example, are forged and most will sell for $3/25. range, so a $50/75. fake is collectible. Don't throw it away........

On the real stamp and the proof, what's up with that vertical line along the right side of the stamp image?

Thanks, Robert

Robert,

I have wondered about this very thing in the past, but you have sparked my interest.

I checked the only reference book I have available to me, the "US Postage Stamps of 1869", by Jon Rose, and can find no mention of the vertical lines on the 90c Lincoln stamps. Not being familiar with the way these were printed, I can only speculate based on what I have observed.

I have observed the following:

1) Looking through all of the pictures in the book, every postage stamp, proof, and essay has these vertical lines that extend above and below the stamp along the right frameline - including the famous unused #132 block of 12. There was one exception - the large and small die proofs.

2) The vertical lines are printed in the same color of the frame of the stamp

3) The vertical lines do NOT consistently align themselves to the right frameline of the stamp. That is, the vertical line can intersect or miss the stamp altogether.

I like to speculate, and this is no exception.

If I were to take a stab at this, I would guess the following -

The plates consisted of 100 dies. Because of the inconsistency of the location of the vertical lines, I would guess that the line did not originate from the dies or plates themselves, but from something on the printing press. The ONLY reason I think this, is that the vertical lines vary in location - either missing, or intersecting the design of the stamp - something that would not be possible if from a die or plate design.

Again, this is just a guess. What it actually is from is gunna keep me awake. Perhaps one of our experts can point me to a better book on 1869s?

Brian

Those lines are indeed on the plate. They are layout lines.

I got tired of my ignorance and decided to try to learn a little about the printing of classic stamps. Russ started a great thread on the subject here: https://goscf.com/t/11260

This was all very helpful, but I have some questions.

1) The Layout lines you speak of - were they on the plate for the purposes of aligning the transfer roll to the plate? That is, can I assume that the plates already had layout lines prior to the process of receiving the transfer?

2) I mentioned the mis-alignment of the layout lines along the edges of each stamp. Is this the result of the siderographer - I learned a new word and had to reuse it :) - not properly aligning the transfer roller?

3) Why are the layout lines so prominent on this issue, and not any of the other 1869s - other than those on sheet edges? Same question about other US classic stamps from this era ...

Brian

Yes, the layout lines were on the plate before any reliefs were transferred to the plate but they were not used to guide the transfer roll. The guide dots are what was used to place the transfer roll in the correct position. The layout lines were used to place the guide dots in the correct locations. Typically layout lines were burnished from the plate, probably immediately after the guide dots were punched into the plate. Why the layout lines, particularly on the 1869 bi-colored stamps, were not burnished out is an unknown to me.

I think most of the mis-alignment of layout lines that you see is actually the result of mis-registration of the two colors and not the result of sloppy transfer roll placement.